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Topic: words out of sync with picture in bedazzled

Shane Pena
Film Handler

Posts: 12
From: Show Low, AZ, USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 10-21-2000 12:22 PM

Anyone have this problem...or know what it could be...In our print of Bedazzled, a couple of customers including myself have noticed that the words and lip movement of the characters are slightly out of sync, the trailers seem fine.
We have a cp500 penthouse. Thanx for any help!!!

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Shane Pena
Film Handler

Posts: 12
From: Show Low, AZ, USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 10-21-2000 02:23 PM

ok, I just watched the trailers and first reel of Bedazzled and noticed that the problem is noticable in both the trailers and throughout the film, the weird thing is that there are scenes that ARE in-sync and certain scenes are out of sync every show.
AHHHHHHH HELLP WHAT COULD BE THE PROBLEM?!

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Aaron Sisemore
Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day!

Posts: 3061
From: Rockwall TX USA
Registered: Sep 1999

posted 10-21-2000 03:10 PM

Seeing that the problem is occuring in both the trailers (assuming you are running more than just the attachment) AND the feature, you may have something threaded incorrectly...

Try running the print in analog and see if the sync problem is still there. If so, get another print.

If not, then try running a different digital film in that theatre, threading it EXACTLY as you were for the current film, and see if there is a sync problem with analog or digital. If the problam is still there with digital, its either threading or an internal problem with the CP500. If its there both digital AND analog its threading.

Aaron

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-21-2000 03:25 PM

Actually if it is in both digital and analogue it rules out threading since they have a penthouse reader. It would be less probably to misthread both above and below the gate

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-21-2000 03:34 PM

Just a thought--do you have multiple penthouses? I once threaded through an SDDS penthouse, then a DTS penthouse, then the projector; the first couple of trailers (mono optical) were fine, of course, but when the SDDS kicked in for the feature (no DTS disks), the sync was horribly screwed up and I had to run that show in SR.

Does the sync problem happen on all reels? Occasionally, a reel might be printed with the soundtrack out of sync, but that's rare. Does it happen in SR, too?

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Shane Pena
Film Handler

Posts: 12
From: Show Low, AZ, USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 10-21-2000 04:42 PM

im going to run a different film through tonight to see if it does the same thing in that auditorium also try SR....if it does is there something that i can adjust myself with the processor? the delay is very very slight, I can tell that the words are spoken before the lips move.

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-21-2000 05:25 PM

How early is it?

Is it off by a couple of seconds? OR is is off by just a bit?

If it's WAY the hell off, you've got more than a threading problem.

I have to agree with the others. Double check and triple check your threading before you go dicking around with the processor. You'd be surprised how many people call me up and complain that the sound is out of sync and I go there and find that it was threaded wrong.

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 10-21-2000 11:46 PM

I didn't notice any out-of-sync problems (but I didn't watch every minute of it.)

I did notice (at the beginning of R2) there was a sort of "jump-cut" where it looked like a frame or two was lost. It occured twice. Since our print was new with no splices, I guess it was in the negative.

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Tom Kroening
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 214
From: Janesville, WI USA
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 10-22-2000 01:06 AM

Well you can't really just knock a DA20 out of sync! Someone could have been screwing around with it. Just make sure you have proper upper loop size. A few people at my work are STILL making the loop twice as big as it is supposed to be!! I can't believe it. I've seen a loop that almost touches the top wall of the simplex (and that sux because the top loop is the only one you can't fix while its running). I don't know why no one listens to me!

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 10-22-2000 07:19 AM

OK, then: how do you fix the bottom loop on a running Simplex?

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Nicholas McRobert
Film Handler

Posts: 38
From: Belfast, N. Ireland
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 10-22-2000 08:10 AM

Hmmmm.....maybe the Hollywood actor's union are in cahoots with the Lab worker's union. That Liz Hurley.....they really have it in for her!

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 10-22-2000 08:41 AM

John,

You can actually adjust both loops but the upper is much harder because gravity is not working on your side.

To answer your question...ride your left finger on the inside of the lower loop and raise the pad roller...then use your right hand to develop slack after the sprocket to make it bigger or reduce tension on your left finger to make it smaller when it is where you want it, close the pad roller. Obviously, the soundhead will limit how much bigger your make the loop.

Steve

------------------
"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 10-22-2000 11:16 AM

Hmmm.... Changing the loop while running sounds a bit too risky for me. I think I would just "admit" I had made the loop wrong, stop the projector and fix it.

Personally, I would like to get rid of that curved casting (that the film can hit right after the intermittent.) I know it is used to hold the bottom of the shutter cover, but a simple bracket could do the same thing, and there be a lot less worry about damaging the film from too big lower loops.

In regard to Nicholas's comment; yes, she scabbed on the union (SAG) and has tried to make up for it by giving $25,000 to the strike relief fund. But, people are still pissed at her. They are going to have a hearing at SAG about her, and others who scabbed (Tiger Woods, and other sports figures, who although are not "actors" per say, are union members.)

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Tom Kroening
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 214
From: Janesville, WI USA
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 10-22-2000 01:23 PM

Yes, the upper loop is REALLY difficult to change, i've only done it once (sometimes i'll practice while the tail is running out). What i do for the bottom one is just throw the pad roller open, pinch the film between two fingers underneeth the sprocket and using a combination of tension and lifting you can make the loop smaller or bigger. If you run out of room you just do the same on the sound drum sprocket (although you have to take care not to trip the failsafe, and it is a bit harder because of the damper arm working against you. it actually worked best on the older soundheads without the damper arm). At the theatre I work at, 12 of the old simplexes are actually missing those curved brackets! There is nothing on there to even replace them so if you bump the shutter guard it will nick the shutter. It kinda threw me off because i use that curved guard to check my loop size.

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Carl King
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 199
From: Saint John, New Brunswick, Canada
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 10-23-2000 10:55 AM

Scott could be correct in his assumption that you may be threading through more than one penthouse unit at a time. When I have both a Dolby and a DTS penthouse on top of a projector it is imperative that only one is threaded through. IF not then the image and sound bite are seperated my more than the 21 frames. This will result your problem. I know this from experience. When I opened the multiplex where I work in 1995 I did thread through two readers and got out of sync sound

Hope this helps.

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