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Author
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Topic: Hexagonal prints? help b4 it falls of the platter!
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Andy Muirhead
Master Film Handler
Posts: 323
From: Galashiels, Scotland
Registered: Dec 2000
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posted 01-02-2001 06:26 PM
Hi everyone, this is my first time posting although i have been reading you postings for some time.My problem is this: for some time now some prints have started to lose shape on the platter when feeding out, so by the time it gets to the last reel, they are hexagonal. Sometimes they even go triangular so by the time the platter has speeded up to pay out, momentum has shifted the film, and eventually they fall off the platter. Emergency measures cause us to tape about 8 plastic film cores round the print to help keep shape. This solves the problem short-term but is dodging the issue! Why then? We have CFS platters. This prob only ever occurs in our No4 Proj room where there is no extraction from lamphouse and can get hot as hell. Is heat or humidity a factor? We do move the print from 4 to 2 and the prob still occurs but not as extreme. Could the film be wound too tightly on the platter on takeup? oh wise people of film-tech enlighten me, as we now have two prints affected this way (Coyote Ugly + Unbreakable - sorry cant remember if they are UK or US prints as i am at home juxt now!) Happy New Year to you all, Andy Muirhead
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John Pytlak
Film God
Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000
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posted 01-02-2001 09:39 PM
Sounds like a classic case of "spoking", caused by excessive film curl when the humidity is too low. At very low humidity, the gelatin film emulsion shrinks, causing the film to curl (cup) in toward the emulsion. Severely curled film is difficult to wind evenly, and may take on the shape of a polygon, rather than a circle. Kodak recommends maintaining projection room humidity between 50 and 60 percent RH. Measure the humidity with an accurate digital humidity gauge or a sling psychometer. I'll bet your humidity is below 30 percent RH. Use an evaporative humidifier to add moisture to the air. Don't use an ultrasonic or misting humidifier, as the salts that are in the water will be spread throughout the box (booth).A free-hanging strip of film should lie nearly flat, with only a slight cupping toward the emulsion ("positive curl"). ------------------ John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging Eastman Kodak Company Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419 Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243 E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
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John Pytlak
Film God
Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000
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posted 01-03-2001 07:33 AM
Dick Vaughan said: "It's not only the condition of the prints because of the low humidity you should worry about. I am sure that your local health and safety inspector would take a very dim view of running without extract on the lamphouse."I agree with Dick. Even with today's "ozone free" xenon lamps, a small amount of ozone may be generated by the high voltage ignition and the ultraviolet energy. Ozone is needed in the upper atmosphere, but is NOT good to breathe. Lamps should be vented to the outside air. As noted, unvented heat from the lamp will make the projection room hot and excessively dry. ------------------ John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging Eastman Kodak Company Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419 Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243 E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
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Erik Schill
Film Handler
Posts: 38
From: Rochester, NY, USA
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 01-06-2001 02:53 PM
Don't feel bad Andy, we have the same problem at my theatre, probably even worse, BUT, even with knowing the problem we are too damn cheap to fix it, we have like a $5 budget for the booth, god forbid if a lamp blows, cause you know we don't have spares laying around. We have these sticky pad things called TECO 1-800-863-8326, they are like $3 a piece (which we had to pay for out of our pockets) and they work really good, unlike cores these stay on the platters, so we use them, and a shit load of cores too, and we have not had a thrown print in a few months, and when that did happen it was because the idiot upstairs was a dumbass and put nothing around the print
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Andy Muirhead
Master Film Handler
Posts: 323
From: Galashiels, Scotland
Registered: Dec 2000
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posted 01-10-2001 06:10 PM
Thanks for all your help!We are now in the process of installing an extraction system for the lamphouse in 4, so will see if that solves our problem. We happen to be in a special position in that our cinema is run by pro's, not just elevated supermarket managers, so they know that when something is needed in the projection room, they give all the help they can. They know that the booth is the most important room in the place, and not the confectionary counter! Thanks again, Andy
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