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Topic: Kung-Pow reel 4 !?!

Keith Peticolas
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 108
From: Eagle River, Alaska, USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 01-25-2002 05:06 AM

Did anyone else get a screwy reel 4 on K.P.? Mine seems to have been double exposed with some Asian soccer movie. Or is this part of the movie and no one warned us. I can't believe this was on purpose because the soundtracks of the two movies overlap and the DTS cut out at the start of reel 4. Never heard of this problem before. Very un-cool.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 01-25-2002 11:05 AM

Not saying it couldn't happen, but to double expose the print would require running the same film through the printer twice. If the orientation is the same (soundtracks printed on top of each other), it would also require a rewinding step. Are the two images in frame with each other?

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Joe Beres
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 606
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-25-2002 11:31 AM

Keith, the asian soccer movie in question could be Shaolin Soccer, which I believe will be retitled KungFU Soccer and released by Miramax in April. Perhaps the lab had reels of Shaolin Soccer printed, and were waiting for a second exposure for subtitles. Somehow a reel of Shaolin Soccer ended up with the "unexposed" stock for Kung-Pow? It's a long shot, I know, but I wanted to let you know that a recent asian soccer film does indeed exist.

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Keith Peticolas
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 108
From: Eagle River, Alaska, USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 01-25-2002 02:17 PM

Thanks John and Joe. Yes the images are in frame and the sound tracks are printed on top of each other. Starts at the top of reel 4 and runs through the credits. And to John, what kind of fool would allow this to happen? I see your point, someone had to rewind this reel and pack it in the cans. Is there any quality control from these people. By the way, it is an ETS print. And to futher my rant: Thanks to ETS for delaying delivering my print until after noon on Thursday. Because this is Alaska I can't get any replacement reels until Sat PM at the soonest. We are going to lose some serious dollars because of this.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 01-25-2002 04:14 PM

That's not ETS's fault. That is either Deluxe Hollywood lab or Deluxe Toronto lab's mistake, whichever one did the printing.

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Keith Peticolas
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 108
From: Eagle River, Alaska, USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 01-25-2002 04:45 PM

You are right Brad, the printing error is not ETS's fault. But if they hadn't shipped it two days later than my usual delivery time, this wouldn't have affected the normal run of K.P. As it stands I'm probably going to lose the entire opening weekend. Someone on the stateside end of things really screwed up.

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James R. Hammonds, Jr
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 931
From: Houston, TX, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-25-2002 04:52 PM

You get movies on Tuesday?
Why cant they do that for us all?

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 01-25-2002 05:59 PM

Keith asked: "what kind of fool would allow this to happen?"

Mistakes happen. The unprocessed print film is handled in a darkroom, with film being printed at over 1000 feet per minute. So a mixup could occur, with someone grabbing a roll that had already been through the printer. Could happen during a shift change, as a new crew comes on line. Something like this is usually a very isolated incident.

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 01-26-2002 08:46 AM

Sell it on ebay and recoup your loss!

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Michael Brown
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1522
From: Bradford, England
Registered: May 2001

posted 01-26-2002 04:03 PM

quote:
Starts at the top of reel 4 and runs through the credits.

Is this film only 4 reels? Whats the running time on that?

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Keith Peticolas
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 108
From: Eagle River, Alaska, USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 01-26-2002 04:31 PM

How the story ends. Received new reel 4 on Sat. am. Only missed all of Friday's income. Youch! That hurt. Any kind of an explanation from Deluxe? NO! In fact, I have to pay to ship the bad reel back to them. It may just end up on a shelf, if they want it, they can come up here and get it. To answer questions. K.P. is 1hr, 22min. Yes, I usually get prints on Tuesdays. Living up here in Alaska I need the extra two days to deal with any problems with prints. Even better, sometime the weather will shut down the airport in Anchorage. That really makes for a fun week. If I get the chance to go to Calif. I'm going to throw a rock through the front window of Deluxe Labs. You heard it here first.
kp

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 01-26-2002 04:38 PM

So it's YOUR responsibility to pay for shipping back to Deluxe for THEIR screwup? I don't think so.

Since you are in Alaska, I would offer them three options:
#1 Return shipment freight charges C.O.D.
#2 Snip off 2 feet from the reel showing their screwup as proof and mail it in a normal envelope.
#3 Let them whine about it for all eternity.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99

posted 01-26-2002 04:40 PM

To be fair considering the amount of footage that passes through a lab daily it is supriseing more mistakes don't happen than do.
Lab procedures vary but it may not have been necassary to rewind it since some printers run both directions so it could have been rethreaded on opposite direction printers.
Yes it is a mistake but considering the turn around times for the large number of required prints that the distributors demand I am very suprised more mistakes don't happen
Remember the final timed negs are sometimes not finished until the monday of a friday opening and the need for 2000+ prints to be struck

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 01-26-2002 08:11 PM

Gordon --- thanks for reminding me about the bi-directional printers. You are correct that would be a more likely scenario than someone deliberately rewinding the raw stock to run through the printer again. As you and I say, mistakes happen and the labs generally do an excellent job give the volumes and timelines they have to cope with.

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-26-2002 08:36 PM

"How the story ends. Received new reel 4 on Sat. am. Only missed all of Friday's income. Youch! That hurt. Any kind of an explanation from Deluxe? NO! In fact, I have to pay to ship the bad reel back to them. "

File a claim with your insurance carrier for lost business and let them fight it out with the lab as to who pays. You contracted for a film that was showable and it wasn't delivered. You lost revenue and lost "good will" with your customers through no fault of your own.

The way that cost cutting measures that hurt the customer get stopped is when the money saved from the cost cutting measures are less than the measurable costs of correcting the resultant mess.

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