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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » 'SIGNS' far too loud.... (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: 'SIGNS' far too loud....
Ken McFall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 615
From: Haringey, London.
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-02-2002 02:27 PM      Profile for Ken McFall   Email Ken McFall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Has anyone else had problems with the sound level on 'Signs'...

At normal fader setting the film was painfully loud!

I was aware that we were running it a bit lower... but when I ran myself two days ago it was almost 1 1/5 steps lower on the fader than normal, we have CP45's in our non-THX screens. We were running on DTS at the time. Adverts and trailers were normal, about 5 1/4.

I switched between DTS and SR during the film and the levels were matched so its not a setup problem or a difference between the sound formats. I've recently done a full 'B' chain in this screen and no problems so its clearly the print.

I thought we'd got away from such dramatic level changes in films with the advent of Dolby becoming standard.

Any comments?


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Wes Hughes
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 175
From: Raleigh, NC, USA
Registered: Aug 2001


 - posted 10-02-2002 02:41 PM      Profile for Wes Hughes   Email Wes Hughes   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
We dropped SIGNS a few weeks ago, and I could be wrong, but I *THINK* that we had to run that film at a HIGHER fader level than normal!

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Ken McFall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 615
From: Haringey, London.
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-02-2002 02:54 PM      Profile for Ken McFall   Email Ken McFall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If we were to run it higher than our normal setting there would be blood pouring from everyones ears!!

I can't recall having the same problems when we opened it in SRD in our THX screen.....

As I said it's not the equipment as the ads etc are running fine as normal. Odd why you would have to run it higher!! I can't see how different print runs would have any real effect on playback levels.... and even then that would not explain why the DTS levels matched corectly?

Just to confirm, other prints are running fine in that screen.


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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:02 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
I remember Signs playing at a regular setting. It did not need to be turned up or down on the prints I ran.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:09 PM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
We played it at regular levels. I thought it sounded very good.

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Manny Knowles
"What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???"

Posts: 4247
From: Bloomington, IN, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:15 PM      Profile for Manny Knowles   Email Manny Knowles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Regular levels (6.5 to 7.0) in SR, SR-D and DTS in various auditoria.

Personally, I thought it was a little on the quiet side, but I didn't go cranking the volume up.


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Mark J. Marshall
Film God

Posts: 3188
From: New Castle, DE, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:25 PM      Profile for Mark J. Marshall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
We also felt it was kind of a quiet movie especially in our larger houses, and especially when they were sold out. We ran ours (SDDS & DTS) slightly above reference level most of the time. I spoke to someone who saw this movie and said that it wasn't scary at all, and I asked her how loud it was. She said "not very loud." I asked "Could it have been turned up a little?" and she said "Yes." That's why the scary parts didn't scare them I think. Just thought I'd throw that in there.

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Ken McFall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 615
From: Haringey, London.
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:33 PM      Profile for Ken McFall   Email Ken McFall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
OK so there are enough of you all saying it was standard!! shame there are no other UK guys looking in, in case it is a problem with our prints....

Looks like I'll be checking the system out in the morning... Can't see what the problem could be.... but I'll check it out anyway, got to justify the extortionate wages I'm being paid.... NOT!!

I'll report back in the next day or so.

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Manny Knowles
"What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???"

Posts: 4247
From: Bloomington, IN, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 10-02-2002 03:39 PM      Profile for Manny Knowles   Email Manny Knowles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I don't want to turn this into a critique of the film but I think there are other reasons why I did not find this movie to be very scary. But I agree that the (lack of) loudness is probably a factor.

In contrast, I can still remember seeing the latest "Halloween" movie in a theatre where they must've had a special fader that went all the way up to 20. A deafening experience. I asked them to turn the volume down twice and I don't think they really did anything about it. I was truly living in fear of the next loud passage.

Back to "Signs"... I must say I really got a kick out of how the surrounds were used when the creatures were scurrying about on the wooden surfaces overhead. Even in SR it was fun to hear that.

~Manny (the devil is in the details).

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Les Brock
Film Handler

Posts: 42
From: Basingstoke, Hamshire, UK
Registered: Nov 2001


 - posted 10-02-2002 06:51 PM      Profile for Les Brock   Author's Homepage   Email Les Brock   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
At the refurbished High Wycombe Filmworks we ran SIGNS on its opening night.

SDDS was used and the fader was run at -2dB.

We rehersed the print earlier in the day and ran at reference level 0dB.

It did sound on the loud side in places but not ear splitting loud.

There is a lot of surround activity but this wasnt over powering.

------------------
Les Brock
Principal Engineer
SDDS Systems.
Priestley Road Basingstoke,Hants
United Kingdom, RG24 9JP

Phone +44 1256 484924

Les.Brock@sonybpe.com

Website www.sdds.com

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Ray Brown
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 111
From: Dayton, WA, USA
Registered: Sep 2002


 - posted 10-02-2002 07:45 PM      Profile for Ray Brown   Author's Homepage   Email Ray Brown   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sounded just fine in our local theater. No one complained.

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Karen Hultgren
Master Film Handler

Posts: 492
From: Agoura Hills, CA, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 10-03-2002 12:14 PM      Profile for Karen Hultgren   Author's Homepage   Email Karen Hultgren   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ken,

I'd suggest a full B-chain alignment to be sure that levels are set properly in the cinema processor. Be sure that your tech uses a setup disc and sets the DTS for 300mV RMS output on all channels. This should match the buss level on the cinema processor.

Karen at DTS
khultgren@dtsonline.com

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Darren Briggs
Master Film Handler

Posts: 371
From: York, UK
Registered: Dec 2001


 - posted 10-03-2002 04:56 PM      Profile for Darren Briggs   Author's Homepage   Email Darren Briggs   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Im surprised people have a normal fader level for features!
Most films are so different in level. i.e Road to Perdition 5.5 MAX and Insomnia 6.5, Thats a big difference in my books.
Darren

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Ken McFall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 615
From: Haringey, London.
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-03-2002 05:02 PM      Profile for Ken McFall   Email Ken McFall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Karen,

thanks for that, I do my own installs now and have a full set of equipment and a full set of DTS discs provided by the good people at DTS in the UK.

I did in fact check the b-chain levels this morning and they are correct. As I mentioned before the levels are the same if switching between DTS and SR when the feature itself is running so its not an alignment fault between the DTS and the CP45.

Besides the adverts and trailers are fine at 5 1/4 which is the normal setting.

It's definitely the print and the DTS track as they match....
The print moves into an SRD screen tomorrow so I'll be interested to see how it compares there.

This is the first time I've ever had a feature that was as loud as this which is why I raised the point in the first place. All our films run within a 1/4 fader step so to have to run a full step down is very unusual indeed. The only other option is a faulty remote fader. For some silly design reason the volume will go to full if there is a dead spot on the fader track or it becomes disconnected. Additionally you can't setup a CP45 with the remote fader... only the main fader. However that would not explain why the adverts and trailers are fine!!

The plot thickens or is it just me


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Jason Burroughs
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 654
From: Allen, TX
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-03-2002 05:15 PM      Profile for Jason Burroughs   Email Jason Burroughs   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
When the theater I'm at moved "Signs" from a stereo house to a mono house, I was supprised how much of the sound was lost in mono. "Signs" makes exensive use of the surrounds, and I would venture to guess that if the surrounds were too low or too high it would make a big impact on how the overall volume sounded in that auditorium.

BTW the opening music is VERY lame in mono.

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