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Author Topic: connecting dvd to DA20 + CP65 Bhaskar Dhungana Film Handler Posts: 28 From: Kathmandu, Nepal Registered: May 2002 posted 03-30-2003 11:59 AM                    How do I connect a DVD to DA20 + CP65 setup in order to get the proper effect of Dolby Digital from DVD player?  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 03-30-2003 12:09 PM                        Wow. I'm really confused. Do I move this to "The Afterlife" forum for home theater or not? I'll leave it for one of the other moderators I guess, as I am incapable of such a decision. Plus it talks about the CP65. Anyway you cannot use a DA20 to decode the Dolby Digital from a DVD player. The DA20 actually transforms video into the digital code. And even then there are the issues of bitrates. Film runs at a constant bitrate in 5.1 all the time always. DVDs are all over the map. Some streams have 2.0 or 3.1 channel sound, etc that the DA20 cannot handle. Dolby has a new device shown at ShoWest this year which can handle every type of bitstream you throw at it, though.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-30-2003 12:18 PM                        Get a DVD player with a built-in Dolby decoder. This will have discrete outputs for each channel. Then, just connect each output to the respective input on the CP65 mag/aux input. You don't need the DA20 at all for this, though you will probably need/want a setup disk and SPL meter to set the levels on each channel.  |  IP: Logged Bhaskar Dhungana Film Handler Posts: 28 From: Kathmandu, Nepal Registered: May 2002 posted 03-30-2003 12:23 PM                    In that case what does it mean when a dvd has Dolby Digital 5.1 at the back? By the way, this is just a experiment that I am trying with a DVD player and a DLP projector. I believe somebody else was trying something of this sort with a CP55.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 03-30-2003 02:16 PM                        Bhaskar, report to my post at the top of Film-Yak!!!! It says 5.1 Dolby Digital on the back of the DVD, but the format on DVD is a bit different from the one used for films. The bitrate is actually higher on the DVDs than in the cinema! That is why the DA20 wouldn`t be able to decode it. Plus, as Joe already said, the Dolby Digital code is read from the film with a mini TV camera and sent to the DA20 not as digital code, but as an analogue video signal of the image of the data blocks. The DA20 then converts the analogue video signal into a digital video signal and scans it for synchronisation and sound data. So you can`t input the digital data from the DVD player. Sorry! But as Scott said, you can easily connect the analogue outputs of the DVD player to the CP. You can also route it through the DA20 if you like. Then you can use the same input for both devices.  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 03-30-2003 03:13 PM                     Roger Dressler of Dolby Labs told me the AC3 bitstreams on film differ from that of the home theater version mainly over copy protection software included in the various bitstreams. You would not be able to feed digital data from a 35mm film print and have a home theater Dolby Digital decoder process it. And a DA20 will not decode a DVD's DD bitstream either. Bitrates aren't much of an issue since all Dolby Digital decoders can handle up to 640kb/s of data. But the film version makes the DA20 process about 550kb/s off the film print, with 320kb/s being the actual audio track and the remaining data used for error correction purposes. That's one likely reason why 35mm film has a lower DD bitrate than DVD or D-VHS (D-VHS has the highest DD bitrate, using 576kb/s instead of the 384kb/s and 448kb/s rates commonly found on DVD). Baskar, to find out if your DVD player has a built-in DD decoder with full 5.1 output check the back of your player. Such players will feature analog line out jacks for all six channels and have them labeled as such. If your player has that, just follow the instructions Scott gave on hooking it up to the cinema processor auxillary input. Most DVD players do not feature full DD decoding and 5.1 analog output of the signal. Such models used to be common when cheaper "Dolby Digital ready" Pro-Logic receivers were available (such models have largely disappeared now). Your best bet for buying a new DVD player with 5.1 analog output is choosing a DVD Audio machine, or a unit that can play both DVD Audio and Super Audio CD formats. The copy protection fanatics have largely prevented such players from being able to digitally output high rez audio streams to outboard decoders and D/A converters for true audiophile quality sound. You're pretty much stuck with having to hook up such a player using 5.1 analog leads. As such, nearly all of these kinds of players feature internal decoding and 5.1 analog output of Dolby Digital, DTS and various other higher quality audio formats.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 03-30-2003 03:31 PM                        quote: The copy protection fanatics have largely prevented such players from being able to digitally output high rez audio streams to outboard decoders and D/A converters for true audiophile quality sound. But they can still output the Dolby or dts data via the digital output? If you hook up such a player to a receiver, most of which convert external alogue sources at 44,1 kHz for internal processing, then you would lose the high resolution of the SACD or DVD Audio. So what would be the point in having the new format?  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 03-30-2003 11:44 PM                     Yes, DVD-A capable DVD players do have standard optical and coaxial digital outputs for sending DTS, Dolby Digital and lower bandwidth LPCM data to a receiver. The Merdian Lossless Packing format for DVD-A and the Direct Stream Digital format of Super Audio CD are both incompatible with standard digital outputs. High bandwidth digital connnections like Firewire would be required. So far that has largely been prevented by groups like the RIAA. There might be a model or two on the market by Meridian equipped with Firewire Input/Output, but I don't know if anything has been done to actually allow such I/O to be legally enabled. For sake of convenience, most DVD-A players feature the full internal decoding and analog 5.1 output of DD and DTS so home users can hook up the 5.1 analog leads to one single auxiallary input without having to wire the DVD player effectively through two source banks on a receiver.  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 03-31-2003 03:53 AM                     The Dolby DMA8 Digital Media Adapter has a 'Consumer Dolby Digital' input. DVD is one of the uses mentioned in the spec sheet. This unit also handles PCM, but obviously would not play dts tracks on DVDs. More surprisingly, it doesn't seem to be capable of decoding MPEG tracks. MPEG audio on DVD is not very common, but it does exist, most are only 2 channel, but I've got a couple of multi channel ones. I've no idea what this thing costs, but I doubt that it is cheap. For occasional use, feeding the bitstream from the DVD player into a domestic AV amplifier/receiver, and taking a 6 channel analogue from that into the mag/aux input input on the CP-65 might be an answer, Im not sure if any signal level or impedance matching would be needed. The DA-20 is no use for DVD.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 03-31-2003 07:28 AM                        quote: so home users can hook up the 5.1 analog leads to one single auxiallary input without having to wire the DVD player effectively through two source banks on a receiver. But if the receiver`s internal processing is digital and the incoming signals are converted to 44,1kHz?  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-31-2003 11:23 AM                     Creative Labs make the an excellent outboard DD decoder that accepts the SPDIF from a DVD player  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 03-31-2003 05:32 PM                     quote: But if the receiver`s internal processing is digital and the incoming signals are converted to 44,1kHz? That is a concern with DVD-A and SACD players. If your receiver or surround controller takes the incoming 5.1 analog audio and converts it into digital data for further processing there is a big concern about audio quality being harmed. With every step of analog-digital and digital-analog conversion, you effectively get a generational loss on audio quality. The high rez MLP and DSD formats of DVD-A and SACD are billed as audiophile master-quality storage formats. But if playback is compromised by extra A/D and D/A steps before the sound hits the amplifiers then it kind of makes using higher quality 5.1 formats instead of lossy Dolby Digital and DTS a moot point. Another added disadvantage with DVD-A players is a general lack of bass management. Apparantly, most manufacturers believe anyone who buys a DVD-A player will have very expensive full range speakers capable of producing a full 20Hz to 20kHz flat tone at full reference volume (very few speaker systems can honestly do that). So if your receiver directs the 5.1 analog audio directly to the amplification stage (which is what you want) you are getting a signal with no bass management, unless your receiver will handle such duties in the analog realm.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 03-31-2003 10:36 PM                        I don`t follow the home entertainment market, are there receivers at all which are SACD/DVD-Audio ready with higher conversion rates than 44,1 kHz? If I understand your first post correctly, then those players can not output high sampling rate audio digitally, or will not do it for copy pretection reasons or whatever. So one would have to go with a 6-channel analogue receiver to preserve the high audio quality. I understand that almost all multichanner receivers on the market have digital internal procession.  |  IP: Logged Bhaskar Dhungana Film Handler Posts: 28 From: Kathmandu, Nepal Registered: May 2002 posted 03-31-2003 10:39 PM                    Couple of more questions: 1. What is it when a DVD player says it has 192kHz Upsampling ? 2. What if I take each of the of the channels from Multi-channel Audio Out directly to my JBL MPA and MPX amplifiers? Would that give me digital sound? How good would that be to the film sound?  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 03-31-2003 10:42 PM                        Sorry, no more questions until you report to my post at the top of the Film-Yak forum  |  IP: Logged

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