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Author Topic: Rear Projection Paul Salley Expert Film Handler Posts: 105 From: Liberal, Kansas Registered: Jan 2001 posted 05-29-2003 08:47 PM                  We have a lobby preview screen with rear projection being used with a digital projector. We are not happy with the image brightness and are looking into setting up a 35mm projection system with a Christie ELF platter (endless loop) to run trailers. My question is how can I reverse the image so it appears correctly on screen. I know other people have done this, anyone with ideas?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 05-29-2003 08:53 PM                     By far, the most popular approach is to use a 45-degree mirror to bounce the image off of on the way to the screen. The mirror needs to be a first-surface type...either glass or stretched-mylar types work well. If brightness is the only issue...a few questions...what type of screen are you using? It is an appropriate type for the lighting conditions of the room...what are the viewing angles you wish to define as acceptable? How big is the video projector you are using? Steve  |  IP: Logged Adam Martin I'm not even gonna point out the irony. Posts: 3686 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 05-29-2003 09:04 PM                     What is stopping you from mounting the video projector to the lobby ceiling and switching to a solid sheet? That seems like it would be less complicated than dealing with constantly changing out trailers on an ELF. Good Lord, did I just condone the use of video over film?  |  IP: Logged Paul Salley Expert Film Handler Posts: 105 From: Liberal, Kansas Registered: Jan 2001 posted 05-29-2003 09:34 PM                  Our lobby is overlit with neon lighting and we have a very high ceiling. The neon seems to wash the image out. Plus I never liked the idea of a projector mounted up high and not being able to clean or service it easily. I,m not for sure if the screen we are using is correct, but it was installed before we took over the theater. The digital projector is a Sanyo Model PLC-XP10NA with a 150 watt lamp. Our first thought was to look for a new digital projector with a larger watt lamp. I think we would have to get other model projectors in here to test the on screen image. Below is our screen size and throw. 55 1/2 X 107 17 foot Throw Screen Brand: SoundFold Model: Unknown  |  IP: Logged Mike Olpin Chop Chop! Posts: 1852 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Jan 2002 posted 05-29-2003 09:56 PM                     Let me recomend the new Christie Road Runner L6. The brightness is increadible! We use it to project a digital preshow. It hits our 60ft screen in a decently lit auditorium while maintaining bright colors.  |  IP: Logged Adam Martin I'm not even gonna point out the irony. Posts: 3686 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 05-29-2003 11:11 PM                     The PLC-XP10NA is only a 1900 lumen projector. That Christie is 5200 lumens and is way over-priced. You can get a comparable Sanyo for a third less. The film projector will be much more cost effective for your application, even though it will be a lot harder to work with. (Unless you really want to spend $20,000, in which case, drop me an email and I'll share my notes for what we're looking at purchasing.) I get to play with a Christie Roadie X10 DLP machine (10,000 lumens!) on Monday.  |  IP: Logged Thomas Procyk Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1842 From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 05-29-2003 11:58 PM                     We had a Strong Endless Loop for a rear-projection lobby screen at the Regal I used to work at. Changing trailers on that thing was a royal pain in the ass, and one wrong move would send the whole "star-shape" of film out of whack. Then you have to break it down, set up the plungers again, re-make-up the whole 1hr 30min trailer pack.... We got a GREAT picture, clear, bright and sharp. They used the mirror technique Steve was talking about. Unfortunately, running the "star-shape" pattern through their crazy brain (I never saw so many of those keeper rollers around the edge!) and through a bunch of rollers to get up and around the mirror, not to mention being in an unfinished room caused a HUGE amount of static, and brainwraps were just about a weekly occurance no matter how careful we were. I tried to coencide the brain wraps around the time we had to change trailers... The thing hasn't been up and running since I left the place in 2000. =TMP=  |  IP: Logged Steven Pickles Film Handler Posts: 81 From: Gainesville, FL, USA Registered: Mar 2001 posted 05-30-2003 12:43 AM                     Thomas, We had the unit running the summer of 2001, but not the endless loop. We just threaded it every 45-60 minutes and let it run through. It works very well, and patrons really like it. The projector (old Century) was not too great, though. Major oil leaks. Overall, I would rather have some other alternative.  |  IP: Logged Paul Salley Expert Film Handler Posts: 105 From: Liberal, Kansas Registered: Jan 2001 posted 05-30-2003 12:52 AM                  My company has spare equipment to do the 35mm setup so really no cost there. The Christie ELF platters are nothing new to us, we run 8 of them now with very little problems, although they do have a mind of their own sometimes. Does anyone have contacts that I could talk to about purchasing the mirror(s)? Is there anything special about these mirrors or do I just call my local glass/mirror company? Thanks for all your feedback guys!  |  IP: Logged Adam Martin I'm not even gonna point out the irony. Posts: 3686 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 05-30-2003 02:10 AM                     The mirror needs to have the reflective surface on the front of the glass, as opposed to a regular mirror where the reflective surface is behind the glass.  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 05-30-2003 07:22 AM                        It is especially important to control the relative humidity when using a continuous loop platter like the ELF. Generally, 50 to 60 percent RH is best.  |  IP: Logged Thomas Procyk Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1842 From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 05-30-2003 06:47 PM                     Steven -- Yep! That's what we would do when we got tired of re-making up the endless loop. I never worked with the Christie version, but anything had to be better than what we went through! I think there was eventually a memo from Corporate that my friend told me about after I left that location saying not to use the endless loop deck anymore because of too many problems at all the locations. I'll agree, it's freaking COOL to see FILM played in the lobby! =TMP=  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-30-2003 07:46 PM                        The Brattle Theatre in Cambridge, MA. has an interesting rear projection setup. The two 35mm projectors face each other and there is a pair of 45-degree front-surface mirrors between them. There is also a 16mm projector with a separate mirror which needs to be manually put into place. I've known several people who have worked there and they all seem to think that framing is difficult, as the masking position isn't visible from the booth. The weak point of most rear-projection setups (film, video, and slides) seems to be the screen. Hot-spots and screen seams are commonly visible.  |  IP: Logged John Anastasio Master Film Handler Posts: 325 From: Trenton, NJ, USA Registered: Sep 2000 posted 05-30-2003 07:56 PM                        Another answer to the brightness problem is to simply use a second video projector with the image superimposed to double the level. It's the way the Museum of Broadcasting in NYC did it in their theater for showing old TV shows. They also had them arranged so that the scan lines doubled up, giving a really clean looking image. It gives you a backup if one fails...and you can always hook up a laptop and sell ad space on it in your lobby!  |  IP: Logged Paul Salley Expert Film Handler Posts: 105 From: Liberal, Kansas Registered: Jan 2001 posted 05-30-2003 08:10 PM                  Scott do you or your friends have access to any pictures of this type of setup?  |  IP: Logged

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