my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home

» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Automation Lens Change (Page 1)

This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2

Author Topic: Automation Lens Change Jeff Klump Film Handler Posts: 22 From: Austin, Texas, USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 08-31-2003 07:18 PM                    At my theatre we have Component Engineering TA-10 automations which allow for lens changes. Up to this point (5 1/2 years) our theatre has never used the lens cue in a public showing. I was happy to be the first person to implement it. Although it wasn't for a loving cause. I had to cue the change because we were out of scope advertisements. What is the theatre world coming to when we have to incorporate lens changes just to accommodate ads?  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 08-31-2003 07:26 PM                     In today's times of supergenuis top masking auditorium designs, switching from flat to scope is one heck of a disappointment. I would flat out refuse to show the ads in a common width setup if they couldn't provide me with scope copies. I was always a fan of side masking auditoriums, running trailers in flat then switching to scope for the feature. Very classy. Ashamed hardly anyone builds like that anymore.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 08-31-2003 07:38 PM                        Mr Klump, you would be surprised to know how much lens changing is going on in some parts of the rest of the world. For instance, in Germany we usually have 20-40 minutes of rolling commercials before the feature. These and most of the trailers are in flat. It would be very impractical and also too cost-prohibitive to have them in scope as well. Often, the company logo and some trailers are shown right before the feature, so we do lens changes often in full flight. Fortunately, most of the theatres have side masking, so the screen opens for the scope feature which in itself is a nice effect.  |  IP: Logged Jeff Klump Film Handler Posts: 22 From: Austin, Texas, USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 08-31-2003 08:01 PM                    I was unaware of all the lens changes out there. I guess I am thankful to working on a turret system. Doing them manually like I used to on some old Century Simplex's would be painstaking. I will agree that is it neat to watch when the side masking opens up automatically. I went into one showing to here the audience reaction and I heard some one say, "OOOOO, widescreen".  |  IP: Logged Chris Hipp Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1462 From: Mesquite, Tx (east of Dallas) Registered: Jul 2003 posted 08-31-2003 08:44 PM                     I would not go through the trouble for the ads. However, I have on a few occasions run out of company institutional trailers and had to make a lens change for it. I just built up a flat trailer pack and then before the movie I add about 10 feet of black leader, so the lens and masking change is not as noticable, and then the movie runs in scope. As far as the dumb preshow ads, I like running out of those so that I wont have to put them on.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-31-2003 08:52 PM                        Quite often we don't have all the trailers we need in the proper format, so I'll do a lens change on the fly if necessary, using the same "black leader" trick mentioned above. We have stage lights, so I fade those back up for the duration of the lens change. A turret is forever on my "wish list" but I just can't justify the horrendous cost for such a simple device. Why are they so expensive, anyway??  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-31-2003 09:11 PM                     there is a lot of presision machining involved plus some major mods to the projector  |  IP: Logged Carl Martin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1424 From: Oakland, CA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 08-31-2003 11:11 PM                        changing lenses on the fly would be a neat trick but there's no way we could do it, especially in the main house. no turret, side and top masking without stops (has to be set with light running through projector and some trial and error), lens must be recentered side to side and projector tilt adjusted, and framing must be adjusted due to uncoordinated aperture plates. there's also a large focus shift which would i suppose be pretty easy to correct, but i have rough marks on the focus knob that work pretty well. it would be interesting to try it after hours and see just how time-consuming/ugly it is. carl  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-01-2003 08:14 AM                        I know of a couple of platter houses that can do automated lens/masking changes, although I doubt that the functionality has been used more than a couple of times. In platter houses, I think I've only seen it done once, anywhere, as a customer. Personally, I've only done it in changeover houses. Agreed with Brad's comments that switching from flat to scope at the start of the feature looks impressive with side masking and lame with top masking. The one exception would be at the Avon, where we use top masking for scope, but show flat trailers using the 1.33 lenses (which are longer than the 1.85 lenses) and a special plate. This results in a very small 1.85 image (same height as the scope image), which then becomes wider after the changeover to scope. It's pretty clever, actually, and looks fine. Personally, I would never go to this amount of trouble for ads. If the advertising company can't be bothered to send the correct number in the correct format, then I see no reason why an exhibitor should go to any amount of extra effort to show the ads. Any excuse to not show ads is fine by me!  |  IP: Logged Paul Trimboli Master Film Handler Posts: 274 From: Perth Western Australia Registered: Dec 2002 posted 09-01-2003 08:20 AM                     In Australia lens changes are the most comon thing there is! Ever cinema runs lens changes for the trailers, I can't remeber seeing a movie that did not have a lens change! In most multiplexs in Australias its automated. I also do the lens change on the fly trick.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 09-01-2003 09:16 AM                     Which direction does your turrets rotate in Australia? Steve  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 09-01-2003 10:58 AM                       When I started in this business, lens changes were a fact of life. I can remember starting the show with a 45-second reel of a merchant ad and a kiddie show announcement trailer, changing over to the scope feature. Granted, these were the days of "continuous picture service" (i.e., two projectors), but I would think with automatic lens turrets it wouldn't even be a concern. Now, as a part-time trailer producer, I get the occasional request for scope trailers because the operator is either too lazy to cue a lens change, the theatre doesn't employ enough operators to properly cover the number of screens, or the theatre doesn't employ an operator at all. The point Brad made about the theatres being improperly designed as an excuse for never changing lenses, is a new one. That's all well and good, but speaking from the standpoint of a producer in a specialty trailer environment, making a scope version involves shooting another negative and keeping a double-inventory. Guess at whose expense? This is what I'm driving at: the circuits have eliminated the craft of projection. They refuse to pay what the job's worth, understaff their booths, and cut corners on design; and they expect someone else to pay for it! I think the following speaks volumes about the current state of the business, and society. I have seen our flat trailers run in scope... ON TWO PROJECTOR SETUPS! That's just plain laziness.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 09-01-2003 12:03 PM                        I can understand that common-width happened out of pure necessity in conversions -- those single screens years ago that were tortured into multiplexes and needed to have common width setups because there was just no other way to physically do it, other than tearing down the theatre (now THERE'S a thought). But do you mean to tell me that today there are NEW builds that actually design auditoria with common-width setups ON PURPOSE? It's absurd and the architect should be banned from ever designing a theatre again. Are there really such abortions out there in any number? At a time when it has become so glaringly apparant that exhibition is in direct competition with home theatre and needs to be bigger and BETTER, doing common-width is like a square TV screen doing letterbox for scope! HELLO....the hot thing now in home theatre is WIDE display screens. Even non-techies know what 16:9 is where it's at. Does the exhibitor think the patron who's got a 16:9 won't realize that this theatre where he's paid $10 can't even do wide screen, but is doing letterbox scope? Even in his home theatre, the flat picture is square and the scope picture is WIDER. And yes, change-over houses do have that advantage -- we can easily do format changes. But automation can do it too -- it's jsut a matter of making it a priority. Our cartoon/attraction reel is ALWAYS 1.37, so that even if our flat feature is only 1.66, the mask and curtains STILL open wider than the trailers and of course the width change from 1.37 to scope is, well, it's practically orgasmic, and it's why scope was invented, damn it. To not comprehend how letterboxing it castrates the scope presentation....well, it's just one of the many major things that's wrong with exhibition. Certain things shouldn't be compromised no matter what the reason. Castrated Scope is one of them. If an exhibitor is doing that, then he should just get out of the business altogether and run a hot dog stand or something, although all bets are on that he will run that half-ass as well. Frank PS -- Steve, above the equator, turrets turn clockwise....below the equator they turn counterclock wise.  |  IP: Logged Daryl C. W. O'Shea Film God Posts: 3977 From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from) Registered: Jun 2002 posted 09-01-2003 12:37 PM                        quote: exhibition is in direct competition with home theatre and needs to be bigger and BETTER, doing common-width is like a square TV screen doing letterbox for scope! You can't very well advertsise WALL TO WALL screens if you've got side masking. Customers are idiots and they'll call you on it. I guess the upside is that if you've got a proper amount of light for the top masked flat picture, you'll have one nice bright scope image.  |  IP: Logged John Walsh Film God Posts: 2490 From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way Registered: Oct 1999 posted 09-01-2003 12:54 PM                     Usually, owners want as many screens in a complex as can fit. This results narrow auditoriums, which means common width screens. Common width is not the worse thing in the world, if done correctly. Getting lenses in turrets to work right is one several problems. We are doing a 10-plex in Chicago, with common width, but I have adjustable top/bottom masking to keep the screen center the same. The problem here though is, people sitting in the front rows will have to look up more for scope.  |  IP: Logged

All times are Central (GMT -6:00)

This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2

Printer-friendly view of this topic

Hop To: Select a Forum: Category: Operations -------------------- Digital Cinema Forum Film Handlers' Forum Large Format Forum Ground Level Feature Info, Trailer Attachments & REAL Credit Offsets Category: Community -------------------- Film-Yak Film Handlers' Movie Reviews The Afterlife Bob Maar's Joke-A-Thon Category: Classified -------------------- Equipment and Supplies Wanted/For Sale Help Wanted/Seeking Employment Category: System -------------------- Software Beta Testing Forum

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.