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Author Topic: CIR splicers Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 09-12-2003 03:49 PM                        Is there a source for these in the US?  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 09-12-2003 03:56 PM                        Links: http://www.cir-srl.com/inglese/ http://www.cir-srl.com/inglese/cinematographic_products.htm#Giuntatrici http://www.cir-srl.com/inglese/cinematographic_products.htm#MAC%202 http://www.mr-moody.com/goldenboy/whoswho7/catozzo_l.htm  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 09-12-2003 03:57 PM                     Frequently you can pick these up for free in your better theater's trash cans.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 09-12-2003 05:30 PM                        Thanks for the links. Where can I buy it?  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 09-12-2003 05:48 PM                        Check with your theatre equipment dealer.  |  IP: Logged Jon Miller Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 973 From: San Diego, CA, USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 09-12-2003 06:01 PM                     Hey, Michael, You could try Christy's Editorial Film Supplies in Burbank, <www.christys.net> or 818/845-1755. They should have parts for them as well. I should warn you, though...Christy's ain't cheap! --Jon  |  IP: Logged Dan Lyons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 698 From: Seal Beach, CA Registered: Sep 2002 posted 09-12-2003 06:04 PM                     Try Ebay. I've seen these go for $50 to $100. I'd recommend getting a used Neumade<japanese> if you're on a budget. I love mine. Danny  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-12-2003 06:28 PM                     Brad you are mistaken CIR splicer are in constant use in the quality deluxe theatres the neutapers are in the dumpsters  |  IP: Logged Ken Layton Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1452 From: Olympia, Wash. USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 09-12-2003 06:32 PM                     Any theater equipment dealer can sell you a brand new one. Of course you could go to the USA distributor J & R Film/Moviola/CIRO Equipment 1135 North Mansfield Ave., Hollywood, Calif. 90038 phone: 1-877-MOVIOLA or (323) 467-3107 or fax: 323-466-2201 URL: www.moviola.com These splicers are known by 3 different names: CIRO, CIR, Dr. Leo. [ 09-13-2003, 11:27 AM: Message edited by: Ken Layton ]  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 09-12-2003 07:06 PM                     Funny how you throw Deluxe into that, Gordon. We all know of their quality standards. This link is sooooooo right on the money! I wouldn't make such a big deal about this if those splicers were even somewhat decent.  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-12-2003 07:10 PM                     Actually I am suprised that proper research wasn't done (read the manual that came with it) as to the purpose of the adjustable pins. It is for shrunken film not producing an overlap  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 09-12-2003 07:11 PM                     So how does that affect a regular projection room of today splicing brand new polyester film? It doesn't. The splices are still shit. Gordon, remember even when we were at ShoWest 2 years ago and you used a brand new CIR you could not make an acceptable splice with it. No wait correction here, YOU thought it was a good quality splice. That would've never passed for me and some of the bystanders. I suppose if you are not picky about the quality of your splices, go ahead and buy the CIR.  |  IP: Logged Chris Hipp Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1462 From: Mesquite, Tx (east of Dallas) Registered: Jul 2003 posted 09-13-2003 02:48 AM                     I have one CIR splicer sitting in a locker. I've taken it out a few times to try to get it to work, just so we would have an extra splicer, but no matter what I do I cannot get it to make a splice or even cut the film. I think the fact that even I can fix a 35ss no matter what would be an excellent marketing angle for Neumade.  |  IP: Logged Dan Harris Film Handler Posts: 86 From: Bristol, UK Registered: Jun 2003 posted 09-13-2003 04:42 AM                     I agree with Brad on this one. These splicers are awful. We've got four of the damn things and not a single one can produce a decent splice. Some people would tell me they havn't been maintained properly, but they are, and I've even stripped them right down before and replaced parts one by one, but they have still been bad. As Joe says in his review "the splicer has never been able to properly punch out all of the perfs in the tape. You must peel each little square off yourself" which is totally true. Even with a brand new and unused blade it still leaves a sliver of tape which you have to trim off with scissors. Unfortunately, the chain I work for wont buy anything else!  |  IP: Logged Brian Guckian Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 594 From: Dublin, Ireland Registered: Apr 2003 posted 09-13-2003 07:28 AM                     I beg to differ guys... Without for a moment questioning your finding the Neumade joiner to be superior, I would nevertheless like to make a few points in defence of the CIR design; 1. The model Joe Redifer reviewed is the SPECIAL, which is only intended for use in film archives, speciality houses, etc. Gordon has already pointed out the purpose of the adjustable pins on the left-hand end. On the right-hand end, the retractable pins also help with deformed film, and are also used to permit a greater overlap cut in particular situations. For example, we've all seen "jacknifed" head and tail splices, where one of the frames is considerably shorter than the other. The retractable pins allow one to slide this frame sideways, whilst still held accurately in the channel, and cut it back precisely so that the next frame comes back into perfect registration. Anyone using this splicer model in a multiplex should check the pin alignment by laying a fresh piece of film in the channel (say a trailer head) and making sure the film lies completely flat, with no strain on the perfs where they sit on the pins. If not, the adjustable pins should be moved precisely. THEN the adjustment knob should be LOCKED by tightening a setscrew located above the knob casting, using a jeweller's screwdriver. This is countersunk into the lip of the film channel and is visible in the review photo. This is MOST IMPORTANT as ANY discrepancy in the pin alignment will change the perf pitch and cause those jumps in the gate. In any case, multis should only have to use the STANDARD model, which has none of these refinements and has fixed pins. 2. The CIR splicer MUST be regularly maintained and checked for alignment to give its proper performance. But what's new about that? It's the same for any piece of equipment. I would say that almost ALL the problems quoted here are due to tiny misalignments, and especially adhesive build up. Even if you strip it down and thoroughly clean it, it MUST be very carefully reassembled and adjusted, paying VERY close attention to the blade position and the alignment of the punch, as well as the picture guillotine (it is not a blade). In my experience blades are blunted and the punch damaged very quickly when misaligned. It makes sense, because even a slight error will cause the blade to unduly strike the steel platen on the film channel, and likewise the tips of the punch to hit the edges of the holes in the platen. Also, the sprung handle must travel smoothly and freely up and down on the steel pillars, if not, undue force will be exerted on the punch and tape cutting blade. (Usually I slightly grease these). Note that once the adjustments are made, they don't have to be altered every time you clean the splicer. In other words, it can be dissassembled enough to clean without further disassembly that would affect the blade and punch alignments. I would agree that it takes a bit of trial and error to get it to work perfectly, and time isn't something in great supply in cinemas today, BUT once it's lined up correctly I can vouch for excellent performance, with NO undue jumping in the gate, ZERO perf damage, NO tape "squares" stuck to the film, etc. etc. Believe me! I recently refurbished one of these splicers, that was held to be "beyond repair" and spent a lot of time on it, and it's as good as new. Maybe you'll upgrade your review Joe from "Blows" to merely "Sucks"?  |  IP: Logged

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