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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » What happened to 2 reels per movie cans? (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: What happened to 2 reels per movie cans?
Allison Parsons
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 630
From: East Peoria, IL
Registered: Oct 2004


 - posted 02-14-2005 12:29 AM      Profile for Allison Parsons   Author's Homepage   Email Allison Parsons   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sorry for the bad subject title.
If my memory serves me correctly, back in the last 90's, some movies were coming to the theater in only two giant reels in big blue cannisters. I know we only got a handful of prints in that way (I think the very first one was Selena) and I'm just curious as to why those went away.

ahhh.. those were the easy days

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Aaron Sisemore
Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day!

Posts: 3061
From: Rockwall TX USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 02-14-2005 12:51 AM      Profile for Aaron Sisemore   Email Aaron Sisemore   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The main reason the went away: They SUCKED.

The Warner/New Line ELR was an interesting concept that was piss-poorly executed.

Do a search for 'ELR' or 'Extended Length Reel' to find more info on those wonderful reels. [Big Grin]

-Aaron

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 02-14-2005 02:06 AM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Aaron Sisemore
The main reason the went away: They SUCKED
TRUE!

for us short people who could just barely get them damned things off the floor doing straight lifting them, let alone trying to get those containers upstairs.

Those big flanges hugging on to those 4inch cores was a trememdous joke.

Then the final straw trying to mount those full reels on MUTs with vertical spindles-trying to aim for the main spindle and dog spindle.

Even the delivery guys hated those containers -

Don't miss them at all.

WEA and NL has been smoking something to try these new things..

Hey, while on the topic of oddities: Remember when FOX came out with those plastic corregated boxes that you had to take a wrap to to close them?

These boxes were just the simple slip over boxes where you had to strap them closed with that red wrap, and the wrap was a joke in itself.

Then FOX came out with the now present plastic corregated fold-down box that almost takes a genius on how to interfold the flaps down. Then the flaps, after being folded down, still love to fly open due to the massive weight.

Still, these boxes are a pain in the ass at times, esp, with the 7 reel variety to haul up the stairs.

-Monte

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James Faber
Film Handler

Posts: 66
From: Des Moines, Iowa , USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 02-14-2005 04:00 AM      Profile for James Faber   Author's Homepage   Email James Faber   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I agree that the boxes suck, but they're much easier to carry if you just pick them up from the bottom, besides the handle. I'd personally rather carry the box than the standard film can. My girly fingers can't support that much weight!

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-14-2005 07:58 AM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
7 reels in one box is just too heavy to lift for many people and those boxes are huge and bulky. They should have made the boxes in 3- and 4-reel sizes instead, which would be more easily manageable.

Is there _really_ any need to put the entire movie in one container? Has anyone ever received only half of a print because one can got lost?

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Stephen Furley
Film God

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From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 02-14-2005 08:39 AM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Scott, aver here the vast majority of films come in one container, until recently a cardboard box. A few years ago a new plastic one was tried, which took four cans I think, so two boxes were needed. In the last few months a new plastic box has come into use, which which will take at least seven cans, I had 'All About Eve' arrive that way on Friday, and I think it would take at least one, possibly two more cans. I'll take a picture of one of these next time I do a projection shift. When I first saw these, I liked them, but I've since found a problem.

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

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From: Loma Linda, CA
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 - posted 02-14-2005 10:32 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If you mean the green Rank containers, they sucked harder than an industrial strength vacuum cleaner! They were bulky plastic boxes containing three slots, each of which could take two reels. So if a film had an odd number of reels one can would be banging around in the box during transit, usually smashing the container and the core. A seven-reel film needed two boxes to ship.

I was once told - it may have been on this forum - that the boxes were designed by some health and safety loon to be deliberately impossible for one person to carry on his or her own. The handles are indeed in a very awkward position. But of course in the real world, a projectionist can't always get help carrying films up the stairs, and so will lift them anyway. I dread to think how many back injuries have been caused by those things as a result.

Whoever designed them should be taken to a cellar and introduced to The Gimp. Furthermore they were so flimsy anyway that most wore within a few months of entering circulation: they'd get cracked or the clasps would come off or whole chunks of plastic would part company from the things.

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Stephen Furley
Film God

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From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 02-14-2005 11:08 AM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No, not those things. I remembered that it was two cans to each slot, but I wasn't sure how many slots. I only ever saw a couple of the things.

Recently the prints have been coming in plastic cases, similar to the cardboard boxes, with the edges turned over metal rods, and the corners reinforced. The lid is attached to the box by a strong fabric strap, with a snap-in plastic buckle. You then pull the strap tight, and it's held in place across the top of the box by velcro. There's a pocket on the side for the label, which you remove and insert with the other side showing for return.

There's a large metal handle on two opposite sides, so you can either carry it in front of you with two hands, like a traditional box, or carry it vertically in one hand, like a suitcase.

The Delux Film Services ones are red, and somebody else's are blue. They're not unlike the BFI blue plastic boxes, but with carrying handles, and the permanent strap and buckle, father than being fastened with plastic strapping, which you have to cut off, and don't have the machine to replace, so you have to tie the thing up with string, or parcel tape.

The two problems I've found are that the plastic is already splitting along the edges of some of the lids, and the metal inside the edges gets bent, so the lids don't fit; a good kick usually puts that right!

The cans seem to be getting worse by the month. Some of them are not just cracked, but literally falling apart, even fairly new ones. They're obviously only designed to be used for one film, but they're not even managing that. The ones which the BFI use, we had a lovely, fairly new, polyester print of 'Sunset Boulevard' in for yesterday, seem much better made. I've still not seen any of the cans with the spigot to hold the core in place. Cans like this, made of the same material as the BFI ones, would be ideal. With nothing less than four inch cores.

I think there's also a good case for new films to be made with longer reels. I'm not sure if you could get 3000 feet in a standard can with polyester, but you could certainly get well over 2000. You can get 3000 feet in typical 2000 foot spoolboxes, for the few places which still have them. The undersized roll of polyester, in a standard size can certainly isn't a good idea.

How are 70mm prints being transported these days?

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Mark Hajducki
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 500
From: Edinburgh, UK
Registered: May 2003


 - posted 02-14-2005 11:28 AM      Profile for Mark Hajducki   Email Mark Hajducki   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Moving Print Distribution use the blue boxes (identical to the DFS boxes except blue)

They sent me 9 reels in one box (the strap just closed). To me that is just asking the projectionists to kick the box down the stairs, rather than carry them.

The green Rank shipping boxes hold 6 reels (3 sets of 2) but the box weighs the equivelant of 2 reels.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

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From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
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 - posted 02-14-2005 01:28 PM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Scott Norwood
They should have made the boxes in 3- and 4-reel sizes instead, which would be more easily manageable
..course, you know all of this was just save on shipping charges, for some airlines/couriers would charge per can instead of the whole feature. Why you saw shipping tape wrapped around the cans at times-to send two cans as one item.

Scott---still love your picts in your page! Interesting history there.

-Monte

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James Faber
Film Handler

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From: Des Moines, Iowa , USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 02-14-2005 02:27 PM      Profile for James Faber   Author's Homepage   Email James Faber   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I absolute HATE it when they tape 2 cans together. They're often completely encased in tape, and it takes you 10 minutes to cut all the damned stuff off.

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000


 - posted 02-14-2005 03:56 PM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Stephen Furley
How are 70mm prints being transported these days?
The last I saw in Darren's projection box (i.e. a fortnight or so ago), exactly the same way they always were: mounted on steel (solid hub) spools inside an individual shipping container for each reel, made of solid steel which is so thick and heavy you'd think the container was designed to withstand a direct hit from one of Ali Musab Al-Zakarwi's rocket propelled grenades, and with a handle on top for carrying vertically.

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Allison Parsons
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 630
From: East Peoria, IL
Registered: Oct 2004


 - posted 02-14-2005 04:43 PM      Profile for Allison Parsons   Author's Homepage   Email Allison Parsons   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I didn't think the 2 reel system sucked as much as everyone else does. I did think that the reels themselves were just a tad bit too flimsy for the ammount of film they carried.

i HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE those damn grey 'boxes' (I think a lot of Fox films come in that way) that are being used now a days. I can never get good balance while holding them. Now if I could just get my teleportation device to work...

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-14-2005 05:44 PM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Monte--I sent you mail...did you get it?

Stephen--In the US, 70mm film is still being shipped in containers like these (one reel per can):

 -

This isn't a great shot, but it's the best one I could find at the moment. The reels are standard "Hollywood Film Company" 70mm shipping reels. The shipping containers are OK, although I had one (out of about 20) that had lots of sharp bits of metal sticking out inside which made removing the reel difficult.

I know that 35mm film is often shipped on cores in the UK--is/was 70mm shipped on cores as well? It would probably save quite a bit in shipping and storage costs, but would probably also be awkward to handle at the theatre level.

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3059
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 02-14-2005 06:10 PM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The one time I handled a 70mm print, well over twenty years ago, it came pretty much like the one in your picture. What size are those cases and spools? They look like they might me slightly smaller than the ones I've seen, but it's difficult to judge from the picture. I saw some similar ones at Bradford a few years ago.

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