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Author Topic: Crackling on 30+ year old print Dan Chilton Expert Film Handler Posts: 191 From: Springfield, MO Registered: Mar 2004 posted 10-21-2005 12:34 PM                        We're running HAROLD & MAUDE for a late night feature tonight from what looks to be one of the original theatrical prints. Although the film is old, it's in good condition. I'm test screening it right now, and there's a very distinct crackle over the soundtrack. It's not the usually his and crackle of an old film, but a single frequency popping. Could it be that the soundhead is picking up more than just the soundtrack? What might be causing this? ALSO: The popping all but disappears during reel transitions. At the first cigarette burn, the pops disappear, then they start back up within 5 seconds of the new reel. I'm totally puzzled. Well, I flatlined the 4 highest EQ settings, and that cleared up the majority of the problem... although the film sounds a bit flat now. Any other suggestions?  |  IP: Logged Dan Lyons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 698 From: Seal Beach, CA Registered: Sep 2002 posted 10-21-2005 02:01 PM                     Is it an IBtech print? Regardless, a print that age will have some shrinkage so the soundtrack might not be being read properly. What type of soundhead ? Exciter or LED? Audeinces don't expect an original print to be pristine, so it's nothing to stress too much about IMO. You could always post a note on the box office warning the audience ahead of time.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 10-21-2005 02:32 PM                     I ran "Harold and Maude" back in '71 and back then Paramount would get on the cheap side with film stock on the side - using "Movielab" stock - anybody remember this stock..? That was the most grainiest and rotten stock that any lab could use (American International Pictures soaked themselves in Movielab stock..) for a good number years beginning in 1970 Thats'a pretty dry print you have there. That print should have been rewound and wound a few times to get the "stiffness" out, then gone through a FilmGuard machine a few times to "lube" it up as well. Why it crackles is that the wind it so much tighter towards the end of the reel than it is at the front. Also, being so tight there are actually lateral cracks in the soundtrack area that the PE cell can easily pick up due to the age of the print. -Monte  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 10-21-2005 02:39 PM                        Movielab was a lab. They used stock from Fuji, Agfa or Kodak, just like most other labs. Could have been issues with processing? (e.g., soundtrack application?)  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 10-21-2005 03:14 PM                     Thx John for that update, for I always took the "Movielab" credit as the stock itself. Then a question to this: What was MetroColor? did MGM had their own stock, or did they use others as did Movielab? For Paramount, Columbia even Disney used Metrocolor.. thx-Monte  |  IP: Logged Bill Gabel Film God Posts: 3873 From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA Registered: Jan 2002 posted 10-21-2005 03:18 PM                     The studio print Paramount has of "Harold & Maude" is IB-Tech. I've run it on a few different projectors and had no problems with the sound. The original and the re-issue "Harold and Maude" prints were done by Technicolor, not Movielab.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 10-21-2005 03:22 PM                        What sort of track is it? Shrinkage can do strange things to VD, and unilateral VA can also be problematic - though that went out of use in the mid-30s, and so probably isn't an issue here.  |  IP: Logged Dan Chilton Expert Film Handler Posts: 191 From: Springfield, MO Registered: Mar 2004 posted 10-21-2005 03:34 PM                        Our print is an IB-tech. Reducing the high frequency EQ seemed to solve the problem. Now the popping sounds like very faint crackling (what you'd expect from a 30 year old print). I doubt anyone will even notice, let alone mind.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 10-21-2005 03:38 PM                     Thx for the update on "Harold and Maude" for this is why I didn't directly mention that "H&M" was in IB since I couldn't remember from back then (and also, I didn't even know what IB (dye transfer printing was back then since I was only in the booth less than two years then..-being a drive-in projectionist fixing speakers on the side...) was - just that Movielab came out all of a sudden when that time Movielab was a good front runner for a lot studios to use. With "H&B" being in IB, then I can definitely see the stress cracking in the soundtrack being of the silver soundtrack variety and with the film stock drying out. For when IB gets that old, it's a pretty dry and alost brittle stock to mess with if not stored correctly. Funny, how the color still remains fantastic after all these years due to "no-fade" syndrome. -Monte  |  IP: Logged Aaron Sisemore Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day! Posts: 3061 From: Rockwall TX USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 10-21-2005 04:01 PM                     quote: Monte L Fullmer Then a question to this: What was MetroColor? did MGM had their own stock, or did they use others as did Movielab? 'Metrocolor' was MGM's name for its Eastman process. It was also the name used for prints struck at the MGM Culver City lab ('Prints by Metrocolor'). All the labs use the same film stocks whether it be Kodak, Fuji, or Agfa (as John mentioned) No studio or lab ever made its own filmstock, nor did Technicolor for IB- IB prints were printed onto receiver stocks made by the big film companies). -Aaron  |  IP: Logged Aaron Sisemore Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day! Posts: 3061 From: Rockwall TX USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 10-21-2005 04:04 PM                     quote: Dan Chilton At the first cigarette burn... Dan you watch too much Fight Club. They are called 'Cue Marks' or 'Motor Marks', NOT 'cigarette burns'. I know of NOBODY in the industry pre-'Fight Club' that ever called them that. Sorry, thats a peeve of mine. -Aaron  |  IP: Logged Dan Chilton Expert Film Handler Posts: 191 From: Springfield, MO Registered: Mar 2004 posted 10-21-2005 04:08 PM                        quote: Aaron Sisemore Dan you watch too much Fight Club. You got me, Aaron. Pre-Fight Club, I was just a projectionist lacky, as in thread it, start it, stop it, rethread it. Now that I'm running the whole show (post-Fight Club), that's the only term I ever knew to call them by. From now on I'll call them "cue marks" or nothing at all... or maybe I'll make up a completely new name for them. Hmm, "sprocket punctures" perhaps. And by the way Aaron, wasn't HAROLD AND MAUDE filmed in your neck of the woods?  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 10-21-2005 04:59 PM                        Out of curiosity I'd still like to know whether this was an area or density track, and if area, of what variety (single unilateral/bilateral, RCA duplex, shuttered NR etc.).  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-21-2005 09:19 PM                     Quote "At the first cigarette burn," There is no such thing it is a cue mark and if some one was idiotic enough to use a cigarette on a print the burn would occupy the entire frame  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 10-21-2005 09:43 PM                       I have seen prints of that era from Paramount develop little clear holes in the black soundtrack area that were not there when the print was first acquired. It's almost as though the soundtrack spots "rusted through" or continued developing after they were stored. Anyone else ever see this?  |  IP: Logged

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