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Author Topic: SDDS -> DTS-ES ? Christopher Meredith Expert Film Handler Posts: 126 From: Jackson, MS, USA Registered: Apr 2006 posted 04-24-2007 11:00 AM                        Before I came to the theater at which I work, there were a number of houses with SDDS which were converted to DTS. As I understand it, SDDS is a 7.1 format. Assuming the speaker wiring was not changed sunstantially in the SDDS to DTS conversion, would it be a trivial process to get DTS-ES working properly in those houses? Thanks!  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 04-24-2007 11:38 AM                        Sdds has 5 behind the screen plus sub; 2 surround channels. DTS-ES has 3 behind the screen plus sub and 4 surround circuits. Not the same thing! Sorry. Louis  |  IP: Logged Darryl Spicer Film God Posts: 3250 From: Lexington, KY, USA Registered: Dec 2000 posted 04-24-2007 12:37 PM                    Plus it doesn't mean that the SDDS units you had were set up as SDDS-8. A lot were set up to only play in 6 channel mode.  |  IP: Logged Christopher Meredith Expert Film Handler Posts: 126 From: Jackson, MS, USA Registered: Apr 2006 posted 04-24-2007 02:41 PM                        Okay, thanks for the education!  |  IP: Logged Dominic Espinosa Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1172 From: California, U.S.A. Registered: Jan 2004 posted 04-24-2007 03:43 PM                     Simple test, see if the rear of the theater has speakers on the walls. If so you had SDDS-8 and DTS-ES should be using those rear speakers. If your DTS unit is not set up as ES those speakers are likely split between the left and right surround channels or possibly a sum of both.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-24-2007 04:16 PM                     ES/EX encoded films are so-encoded in all 3 digital formats, so your SDDS setup could certainly have been wired for Surround EX/ES. This has nothing to do with whether it was SDDS-8 (extra front channels) or not. But you would have needed an external surround decoder, like the Dolby SA-10 or the DTS-ES, or various cobbled-together solutions involving a Dolby Cat.150 card and perhaps a CP50 (see other threads). "Simple test, see if the rear of the theater has speakers on the walls. If so you had SDDS-8 and DTS-ES should be using those rear speakers." Err, any sound format, from 4-channel analog SR up to 9-channel SDDS-8+ES/EX, should have speakers on the rear. Yes, in a non-ES/EX arrangement, the rear speakers should be split between the LS and RS channels, but in ES/EX, they are switchable between LS/RS or back surround. With respect to wiring, the question is whether your rear speakers are split into left and right, terminating in separate amplifier channels in your booth. --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 04-24-2007 06:34 PM                        quote: John Hawkinson was the last to post Simple test, see if the rear of the theater has speakers on the walls. If so you had SDDS-8 and DTS-ES should be using those rear speakers. Uh, no. Speakers on the wall has nothing to do with SDDS 8. As the second post says, SDDS has 5 behind the screen. The only person who likes 5 behind the screen is Steve Guttag. So it is likely that all of his SDDS houses are setup for 5.1.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-24-2007 09:01 PM                     Umm, Joe, notice I was quoting (and refuting) Dominic. --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Adam Martin I'm not even gonna point out the irony. Posts: 3686 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 04-24-2007 09:07 PM                     The board software automatically reads back and inserts "xxx was the last to post" when you use the quote function ... Which you'd know if you ever cared to properly quote something.  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-25-2007 12:48 AM                     Lets back up the bus sdds install by itself doesn't dictate any specific surround array It can be configured to mono surround as weel It is best to get your service engineer to make the choice if something is going to be changes also steve is not the only person on this forum who likes 5 screen channels  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 04-25-2007 06:27 AM                        I like 5 screen channels, too! The correct way to determine if EX is wired is to see how many amplifier channels are used for the surrounds. There have to be 4 channels. Although that in itself doesn't *necessarily* mean they are wired in an EX fashion. But many system designers like to split up the surrounds into L, R, Lback, and R back and then use several speakers in parallel to bring the overall impedance down and gain more power from the amps. So, if there are only 2 channels (as in one stereo amplifier), you can forget that then and there. If there are more, you have to figure out how they are wired to the speakers. You will typically also find a J-box on the wall with terminal strips where the speaker wires are landed and connected to the ones coming from the amp. That usually tells you a lot. If you have a J-box in which all the wires are landed but there are only 2 channels wired inside, you can still add one amp and rewire there. Although I personally don't think it's really worth it. The EX thing was more a gag. When you have well set up and tuned stereo surrounds, you get a very similarly spacious effect, at least in central seats.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-28-2007 08:53 PM                     So, I was reading EG18-1999 yesterday, and apparently it recommends 5 screen channels, switching L/R between the outer two (for scope) and the next-in pair (for flat). Does anyone actually do that (perhaps people who have SDDS-8 anyhow?)? --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-28-2007 08:59 PM                     That was an option on the cp200 that in all our THX installations way back when was mandatory  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 04-28-2007 09:30 PM                        We did that in Berlin in a few screens which had 8-channel SDDS. Just because we had the speakers there anyway and we could. But with reasonably acoustically transparent masking, it really makes hardly a difference. We also fed some of the LF information from the attached DTS-6D to the LE and RE channels, in "baby boom" fashion, that was really nice, too, it added a little richness to the bass, but again, it was more for shits and giggles than a really drastic and generally noticeable improvement. Just like EX, you can do these things, but you don't have to. A nicely configured and set up "standard system" is really just as good and satisfying.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-28-2007 10:51 PM                     Virtually all of my 5-screen channel theatres use LC/RC for 1.85 and narrower ratios. If you can't hear the difference, either your hearing sucks or your tuning does. More recent examples of our installations with 5-screen channels that switch narrow down for smaller ratios include the AFI/Silver in theatres #1 and #2, the NCTA theatre where Video is the primary format and the screen full open is 16:9. LC/RC are in use there for 4:3 videos...especially if the video was mixed for just Left and Right...having speakers substantially beyond the picture area creates a very disjointed sound field and a noticable void in the center. I have made a "Kit F" board for use with CP200 installations that put the L/Le R/Re switch as the signal feeds JM21 so all digital formats may also be switched instead of the factory way that performed the switch in the Processing Unit before the signal left JM11. Steve  |  IP: Logged

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