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Author Topic: Would you trade a new Horizon 5565 for a Used Century Projector/Christy Platter? Benjamin Speed Film Handler Posts: 6 From: Franklin, Maine, U.S.A. Registered: Feb 2009 posted 02-22-2009 02:16 PM                        Hello - this is my first entry. I am writing from The Grand Theater in Ellsworth, Maine. We are a calendar art house that features films only 4-5 times a week at most, when there isn't a concert or play on the stage. Thank you for considering my topic? After retiring two projectors (Century Projectors with newer Super Simplex lamp houses) from 1939, we decided to pursue a projector from Horizon, a Chinese company that uses Xenon bulbs. We knew we weren't getting a Cadillac, but we were hoping that at least it would run for 10-15 years until we cold invest in a larger digital/server system. Boy have we been disappointed. Since August, 2008, from replacing a sound head, aperture plate, reader cards, to parts failing and just recently breaking in half, the machine has been in repair for more days than it has been in service. Needless to say we have asked for the machine to be removed. Instead of the Horizon dealer offering to refund us, or replace it with a similar model, he has offered to replace this Horizon 5565 All-in-One system with a USED Century SA Projector along with a Christie AW-3 platter system. We would be able to use our current lenses. My question is, if we paid $13k for the new Horizon projector, is a used Century projector and Christie platter system a good deal, and will we be satisfied (keep in mind, we purchased the Horizon All-in-One system, because we are tight on space)? What would a new system like this Century/Christie go for? Should we take the offer, or push for a refund?  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 02-22-2009 02:27 PM                     1- Welcome to Film-Tech! 2- Going from Horizon to Century/Christie setup would be a definite plus. Those two units will last a lifetime. 3- Depends on how old the AW3 is (does it have the removable brains, or are they a solid brain setup?). A good used AW3 will still garnish decent bucks if in good condition (better get the makeup table included in this package) As for the Century (and should come with the R3 soundhead), even though if used, the also can garnish some value as well if in great conditon. Funny, no mention on a lamphouse or console on this package. Better include that, plus a discription of that before a final judgement call from us can be made. good luck-Monte  |  IP: Logged Phil Hill I love my cootie bug Posts: 7595 From: Hollywood, CA USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 02-22-2009 02:35 PM                  Welcome to the Forum. I wouldn't trust this dealer for anything. What's to say his "used" SA isn't beat to hell? There are several rebuilt Century SA projectors and R3 soundheads available for about $2500. Push for a refund and then get a new and honorable dealer!  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 02-22-2009 02:37 PM                        No, you are removing a defective NEW projector. I assume that the trade equipment is used, rebuilt, or remanufactured??? BTW: The reason a Century is called that is that the designer was told to "make it last a 100 years." Western Electric had just previously invented the ball bearing!! Still selling rebuilt Centurys. Louis  |  IP: Logged Robert E. Allen Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1078 From: Checotah, Oklahoma Registered: Jul 2002 posted 02-22-2009 02:45 PM                     I agree with Phil. There are plenty of used/reconditioned Centurys around at reasonable prices and they will last longer than you and I will. Then you'll have extra funds to buy something else you'll need for your house. BTW I would suggest you go for a two projector changeover system for classic films. The distributors will not give you their best prints for a platter system.  |  IP: Logged Richard Fowler Film God Posts: 2392 From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA Registered: Jun 2001 posted 02-22-2009 02:46 PM                     For a tight space situation in a cultural center, a large reel transport with projector / lamphouse I feel is better than a platter / projector set up. The same type of locations I service the platter is always "abused" as a tech table / storage or pushed around to let some other hardware to be used.....and usually is the most serviced item. The Horizon / Harbin all in one unit film take up dancer arm is a problem and the platter set up is asking for trouble if your operator is not tech savvy. The all in one comes with a lamphouse / power supply, set up either for up to 3kw or 5kw.. A "rebuilt" Century package and "rebuilt" AW3 may be your best bet.....  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 02-22-2009 02:58 PM                     Benjamin, welcome to F-T first of all. I also second what Phil said..with the amount of running time you have those machines shouldn't have had so many failures..there is another member here who is trying to deal with that junk. Definitely push for a FULL refund of your money and you can easily spend a lot less on REBUILT equipment. For that same $13k I could have set you guys up with a fully rebuilt AW3, a Fully rebuilt Century JJ 35/70 and 4k lamphouse. I would love to know who that dealer is.....he may deserve to be outed in the "Deadbeats In The Industry" thread if he doesn't make good on this.. Edited to add: Did that dealer end up with your old equipment? If so I would beware, he may try to "trade" back your old equipment and still walk away with your money.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-22-2009 03:58 PM                     Absolutely get a full refund! You got screwed by this dealer big time! The used Century/Christie gear he is offering you is worth about 1/3 or less than what you paid for the new Chink projector. Remember, because of all the Digital going in (and contrary to what some here may think there IS alot going in) there is a glut of used equipment out there... ya need a reputable dealer for sure but because you are space limited I'd go with an all Christie booth because it'll require MUCH LESS maintainance than an older Century/Simplex type booth will require. The latest Christie P-35's are pretty darn hard to beat, require no oil and only need belt changes now every 3 to 5 years. Belt cost is only about 30 bucks!! Also, because of your space limitations consider a Christie Miniwind platter instead... the advent of Estar based film will allow alot more film to go onto the smaller 42" decks than you could with acetate. Mark  |  IP: Logged Richard Hamilton Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1341 From: Evansville, Indiana Registered: Jan 2000 posted 02-22-2009 04:30 PM                     quote: Mark Gulbrandsen Chink ????  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-22-2009 05:00 PM                     My concern would be what type of lamphouse and rectifier is in the replacement package I would check what the terms of your warranty as to what options you have In samll enviroment like that you may want to look at the ernamann all in one with the built in sidewinder or the like one from spain  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 02-22-2009 07:22 PM                     Don't take the deal. Demand a full refund. For less than what you paid, you can get a rebuilt (and by rebuilt I mean PROPERLY rebuilt) Century SA with a rebuilt AW3 platter and a suitable lamphouse. (Don't get anything ORC.) Then again you could get a brand new Christie projector and SLC lamphouse for about that money and pick up a used platter to mate with it too. Whatever you do, demand a full refund.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 02-22-2009 09:13 PM                     quote: Richard Hamilton RE: quote: Chink ???? That's the sound a Strong Console's AC ignitor makes.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 02-22-2009 09:58 PM                     Actually, they go "pop-pop-pop-pop!" then "chink" - then you want to cuss...  |  IP: Logged Andrew Bangs Expert Film Handler Posts: 148 From: Kerrville, Texas, United States Registered: Sep 2008 posted 02-23-2009 02:20 AM                        Speaking from experience with these damned machines get a full refund. I have ten screens of these Horizons and they are a constant bother. plus it is hell to get someone out to work on them. I have had to do a nightly dance and hold my face just right for them to keep working properly over the last year. and where I was primarily only having trouble with the Platters now the projectors are starting to give me headaches. I think most of them are one loose screw away from failure. in the past month I have had a rectifier die, a shutter disintegrate, and a main power failure (for no apparent reason the projector just shuts down). These projectors were only built (from what I have been told) for a limited run to get us through to the Digital age. Well with that taking longer than expected. these buggers just are not standing the test of time. Some really neat ideas were implemented with this equipment but what is great in theory has yet again failed in practice. Sorry if I seem a bit harsh but I am constantly on edge that I will receive a call from the theatre saying # whatever has stopped working and we don't know why. Because it does happen all to often. Ok Rant done! in the end I say cut bait and run. Get your refund and go get some descent Equipment that will last. and make sure it will last for another good five to ten years cause that may be how long it will take to get this wonderful Digital to the small houses.  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 02-23-2009 06:10 AM                     New isn't necessarily better. Century's are tried and true, easy to operate and reliable and will outlast us all. This isn't a dump on Chinese equipment but it is built to a price-period. You pays your money, you gets your dues. Just a thought- why is it that in the video realm, equipment is constantly being replaced and upgraded due to incompatibility with new standards and formats whereas film equipment can run (albeit with minor modifications) prints from the 1920's? THAT is film's big advantage-it is built to an international standard. 'Nuff said. Video Sucks. Anyone remember 2" quad?  |  IP: Logged

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