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Author Topic: what projector is this Jeremy M Smith Film Handler Posts: 48 From: Taupo New Zealand Registered: Aug 2008 posted 12-29-2009 12:14 AM                     can someone tell me what type of projector is this and where I can find a manual ? THanks  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 12-29-2009 12:26 AM                        It's probably a Kinoton.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 12-29-2009 12:28 AM                     You can trust Joe. He is a sharp guy with an amazing knack for attention to detail.  |  IP: Logged Robert E. Allen Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1078 From: Checotah, Oklahoma Registered: Jul 2002 posted 12-29-2009 12:30 AM                     Joe can read???  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 12-29-2009 12:34 AM                     Looks like a Philips/Kinoton/Norelco FP20. The manual for the FP20 is in the "Manuals" section to the right.  |  IP: Logged Randy Bowden Expert Film Handler Posts: 146 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Aug 2000 posted 12-29-2009 02:03 AM                     It's a 35mm projector  |  IP: Logged Jeremy M Smith Film Handler Posts: 48 From: Taupo New Zealand Registered: Aug 2008 posted 12-29-2009 02:17 AM                     thanks Ian right on the money  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 12-29-2009 02:46 AM                        quote: Ian Parfrey Looks like a Philips/Kinoton/Norelco FP20. The manual for the FP20 is in the "Manuals" section to the right. WRONG!!!! It's on the left.  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 12-29-2009 03:08 AM                     quote: Joe Redifer WRONG!!!! It's on the left. Well I remembered about Philips, so there....and...and ..Norelco, too yeah! Anyway, I'm taller than you so I win. (Looks for "crybaby graemlin- can't find one so chooses this one.....)  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 12-29-2009 03:39 AM                        I am 7 feet tall.  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 12-29-2009 03:45 AM                     I'm 9'11". ...not blue though...or a Smurfcat.  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 12-29-2009 06:12 AM                     Any idea of a date on this one? It's got the later type column, as on the FP-30, but the old style hat shaped inching knob, though it's in a slightly different position to I've seen it on other machines. It doesn't have the sort of crescent shaped rocker switch below the sound head, nor the buttons in the same position, for start/stop and changeover, so presumably it has the still later version, with the buttons in the stupid position on the front of the column. The turret looks newer than the rest of the machine, and the shutter housing is unlike any I've seen, and what's that thing beneath it, automatic aperture plate changer? I've never seen one on a Kinoton, nor a turret, but I do know that they're available. If that is what it is, then presumably it was fitted from new, since the old looking shutter housing seems to be shaped to avoid it, but I doubt that you'd have one of these fitted unless you also had a turret, and the turret looks new. Is this an intermediate version of the machine, between ones which I've seen, or one that's been assembled from various parts? Difficult to believe that the FP-20 design is now 50 years old.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 12-29-2009 08:40 AM                     It is not an FP20 it is an FP30...look at the length of the unit. Another "tell" is that the beige plates, all of them, span the length of the machine. The FP20 is more slender and often its golden/brown color is predominate with the beige plates only in select areas, on some versions. The model number is obstructed by the turret controller in the picture. The turret makes me want to say it is an '80s or '90s version. The FP30 mechanical machines didn't change all that much over the years (except features specific at the time of order)...the film path remains pretty much the same. With the Direct Drives, you loose the separate inching knob as it moves to a sprocket shaft....the direct drives were standard by the late '90s. Steve  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 12-29-2009 09:25 AM                     The pair of FP-30Ds at Croydon which I used to run went in new in May '94 I think; I don't know how long the model had been available at that time. I don't think I've ever run a non-direct FP-30; how long an overlap was there between the models? I've run quite a few FP-20s, both pairs and single machines with a tower. Strange machines when you first see them, but they seem to work well. Must have seemed revolutionary when they were introduced, especially the ones with the pulsed lamps. I don't like the inching knob on the top sprocket shaft; much stiffer to turn than the old ones. I also don't like the position of the control buttons on the front of the column now, seems a really stupid place to put them. In fact, in many ways I think I prefer the older FP-20 to the newer machines. Maybe it's just the photograph, but the shutter housing in the picture looks like the older, greyer colour, while the turret seems to be the later, more golden one. Has anybody used the new FP-20a? How do they compare eith the other Kinoton machines? What do you lose for the cheaper price.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 12-29-2009 12:29 PM                     You can have the controls mounted facing the operator on any current Kinoton...including the FP30D (The "D" series came out in '92 or so). I don't know what the "overlap" years were. I know we were putting in conventional FP28s (non-direct drive) in 1993 for sure. This picture is from an installation we did in 2007 with FP30Ds. Note the control panel facing the operator. Furthermore, we augment that with additional motor/changeover controls mounted on the front wall of the booth (to the left of each CP650 remote) so the critical controls during a changeover are right at your fingertips without having to take your eyes off the screen. The shutter box for the FP20 or FP30 hasn't changed in forever other than the original was a nicer rolled piece the current one has sharp corners. The inching knob on the sprocket shaft came about since the old inching knob was right on the motor itself. With the Pabst direct coupled motor, there is no shaft to grab onto. It suppose it would be possible to put a gear reduced shaft in the chain path, if they wanted to. I think there was such an option, once upon a time. If you want to give Kinoton a headache...order your next FP30D with a 8990 242 500100 "Drive unit with handwheel built-in projection unit." It will probably make them scratch their heads In their mind, once they gave you the "POS" button, there was no need for the inching knob. The FP20A is mislabeled, in my opinion...it has zero relationship to the FP20 line but they couldn't use the FP30A designator since that had been taken. The "A" line is their "Affordable" line, as some call it. On the FP20A...like all As the turret does not move out for easier film threading. The rear door isn't a door but a cover so you have to unscrew the panel to service the unit rather than just opening it up. You also do not have as many choices on accessories...just the basics and popular items (cue sensors and such). With the A series you loose the inverter drives (hello capacitors)...and I believe the control boards are different too. Steve  |  IP: Logged

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