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This topic comprises 2 pages: 1 2
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Topic: Rogue One low constrast
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Mark Ogden
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 943
From: Little Falls, N.J.
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 12-19-2016 05:39 PM
quote: Tyler Purcell the Alexa 65 doesn't make it better as that camera works the best in low-con situations
I'm very curious as to why you say that, especially as the camera is capable of over 14 stops dynamic range. Even if it were true, as long as the show is output in uncompressed ARRIRaw, the DP and colorist can make the contrast whatever they want.
I'll tell you what I DID notice today at the local Dolby Vision screen. They go thru the whole pre-show rigamarole about how great the contrast and is, and they do the "Yes, the projector is still on" thing to show how deep the blacks are. And then the moment the file with the feature started, the image went from deep black to not-very-black at all, more of a gray. I started to wonder if there was an error in the Dolby Vision mastering for the show. The rest of the picture played with unremarkable contrast and seemed somewhat low in luminance, although there were spots that were quite bright, the final battle sequence for example.
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Tyler Purcell
Expert Film Handler
Posts: 180
From: Van Nuys, CA
Registered: Dec 2015
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posted 12-20-2016 12:10 PM
I think you'd find most cinematographers try to generate looks like that in camera. Sure, you could "fix" it in post if you wanted, but since the cinematographer is usually present for coloring, they will veto any major changes that don't fit their vision. Not saying the Alexa 65 is magical, but what the bigger imager and better electronics allow the filmmakers to do, is have less noise in the blacks. This is really what allows them to make a product with those flat mids.
In terms of the HDR laser projection system. Basically it's kind of a scam. All it does is roll-off a certain part of the black level into "mirror off" for that pixel. It's an encode, decode system however, so if the movie isn't specifically sent with the right packet data to be presented in HDR, it won't be. This is why the black level lifts after the demo, because Rogue One wasn't made that way. It would be easy for them to adjust the software on the projector to compensate, but Dolby wants people to pay for their licensing of HDR. So they want it to not look as good, hoping they'll eventually get some cash out of filmmakers for the future.
I'll say this much, with all the technology and money being spent on making digital projection look good, it still doesn't surpass a good 5/70 print with a proper calibrated projector.
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Connor Wilson
Expert Film Handler
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Posts: 190
From: Sterling, VA, USA
Registered: Jan 2011
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posted 12-20-2016 02:22 PM
I hate to put myself as some sort of Nostradamus but I'm pretty sure I saw this coming. Trailers hardly, and ever so rarely, represent the final film whatsoever. Jurassic World and The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug are classic modern-day examples of this. I did not see Rouge One's theatrical release yet (I don't really plan to) so I cannot speak on behalf of the film's poor contrast. Like I said in the link, it could have been a stylistic choice above anything.
The funny thing about Laser projectors and contrast is that the black levels will hardly matter depending on the auditorium's lighting and the content. For IMAX with Laser (namely at the Udvar-Hazy Center), some content will have the blacks go as black as they can (Ant-Man, IMAX docs) and others are mastered for standard xenon projectors (Jurassic World, this was its IMAX-only second run later on). I guess the same happens at Dolby Cinema. Rouge One was indeed mastered in Dolby Vision (according to Dolby's website) so whether the contrast was intended to be mediocre or it was a DCP mastering goof, maybe visual effects artist-turned-director Gareth Edwards took advantage of the wider color gamut at the very least.
Even if you get the blackest of blacks, it won't matter if your exit signs are next to the screen. In the Dolby Cinema at AMC Empire 25 (I'm told this also happens at AMC Tyson's Corner 16), the red glow of the exit sign shines on the left corner of the screen, making it very distracting at dark moments. The IMAX with Laser setup at Udvar-Hazy still has a little light reflecting around the auditorium, not as bad as Dolby Cinema at AMC Prime but the screen sometimes look to have a minimal TV-esque glare. You can't trade off safety for perfect contrast.
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