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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Community   » The Afterlife   » DTV Feb 17 Deadline May Be Delayed (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: DTV Feb 17 Deadline May Be Delayed
Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 01-25-2009 04:05 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
With only 23 days left (as of this writing) and counting for the February 17 deadline to end analog TV broadcasts this news isn't too surprising.

The President has urged congress to delay the DTV switch deadline to June 12. The main problem is funding has run out for DTV converter box coupons, leaving thousands on a waiting list.

The Nielsen group estimates about 6 million households out of over 130 million in the United States are not ready for the DTV changeover.

Representative Henry Waxman and Senator John D. Rockefeller are pushing a bill that may come to a vote on Monday, Jan. 25. Rockefeller says he has the support of the ranking Republican on this technology subcommittee, Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison of TX. Some Republicans are pushing some competing legislation to keep the February 17 deadline intact and get converter box coupons to those who need them at a faster pace.

Confining this discussion to DTV deadlines (without it stupidly venturing into partisan politics) I think it's a bad idea to delay the deadline to June 12.

Yeah, it sucks that a few million people may see their old analog TVs go black after February 17, but I think that's just tough shit for them. Sorry to sound hard about it, but that's how it goes. The general public has had more than a decade of advance notice that this change was coming.

This February 17 deadline is already a delayed date. The original changeover date is a couple of years in the past. Adding another four months to the delay will frankly change nothing. Those who have chosen to procrastinate won't change their behavior. There's a lot of people who will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the DTV future. What's worse is if this four month delay is passed the hold outs may get the impression the DTV change will never happen. When June 12 approaches the procrastinators will just expect to see yet another delay and another and another after that. Cut the damned analog signals off already; the vast majority of Americans are already prepared for it.

Some large and small businesses may lose quite a bit of money in this additional four month delay. Telecommunications companies like AT&T, Verizon, Sprint, etc. spent large fortunes in the auction of soon to be vacant analog broadcast spectrum. With the kind of money spent, they need a return on investment as soon as possible. A four month delay will cost them millions and lead to more job losses.

Local TV stations are caught in a jam on this issue too. Many are having to ramp their DTV signals up to full power in advance of the February 17 analog cut off date. They have to know all the bugs are worked out of their DTV transmission systems.

Running a DTV channel at full power is not cheap. I've been talking with the general managers and some engineers of the local TV stations in my viewing market. KFDX channel 3 in Wichita Falls, TX boosted their DTV signal to 1 million watts a few days ago. They did this because they're going to be airing Super Bowl 43 and wanted to be ready.

I had never been able to receive KFDX' analog broadcast well at all via my outdoor antenna. The signal was often very snowy. But their DTV broadcast comes in GREAT on my TV. It looks even better than most of the HD channels I get via Dish Network. KFDX even has all the Dolby Digital stuff enabled.

I figured it would be a good idea to point out this fact because the popular belief is that the DTV signals will not come in as well as the analog ones. Some of the procrastinators are deliberately holding out over this point or because they think this is a conspiracy to make people get cable. If anything, the reverse is true. The HD image quality I get from my local ABC and NBC affiliates often beats what I see on cable or satellite and it's FREE.

Anyway, stations that run their DTV signal at full power and then are stuck having to preserve a full power analog broadcast for four more months are going to get one hell of an electric bill. This proposed delay is just not fair to those TV stations.

I wrote both US Senators for Oklahoma as well as the US Representative in my district about this issue and urged them not to delay the February 17 switch. Anyone is free to have whatever opinion he wants to form on this matter. But if you agree the February 17 deadline ought to be maintained you might want to write your elected representatives about it.

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 01-25-2009 04:37 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hawaii has become the first state in the country this month to convert to all digital broadcasting by all of our television stations. From what I had heard, the transition from analog to digital went very smoothly.

I cannot understand why the current administration would like to delay the scheduled transition date because the public had years to upgrade to digital. If Hawaii can do it, I do not understand what is the big deal with the rest of the country.

-Claude

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Chris Slycord
Film God

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From: 퍼항시, 경상푹도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted 01-25-2009 04:48 PM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
To label all those that didn't switch yet as procrastinating ignores the facts of the matter.

When large portions of the population only recently got the whole story since ads on TV previously only told them that digital was coming and to go to a website for more info, so anyone without internet didn't get the info. They surveyed people and found that right before their change in advertisements, lots of people had misinformation, thinking that they could ONLY switch by using a new TV set or cable. Then add to the fact that the converter box coupon campaign that was set up has run out of its funding already. Yep, all those things happen because of procrastination.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 01-25-2009 05:29 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The process of switching TV to HDTV has been a work in progress spanning well over 20 years. I don't buy it that huge numbers of Americans have only just been finding out about the impending change just recently.

Surveys are only as good as the level of honesty those being asked are willing to provide in their answers.

I contend one has to have been living in a cave cut off from electricity for the past few years not to know the DTV change was coming. Many of the people who aren't yet prepared for the switch simply don't want the switch to happen at all. They want to keep using that old TV for another 20 years, progress be damned. If the June 12 delay goes through, we'll be having this same discussion about yet another delay later this Spring. Many of the hold outs are not going to make any changes until they are forced to do so.

There's also no constitutional right to receive over the air TV either. Television broadcasting is a largely private business driven by advertising. I think the general public should be thankful for the $40 coupon the government is providing for converter boxes. I think those devices are largely crap, but at least they're better than nothing and will at least keep an analog TV set alive. Most Americans have pursued other alternatives, like subscribing to pay TV, buying new DTV capable televisions or both.

I wouldn't have as much of a problem with this proposed delay if the issue had been discussed at least a couple or so months ago instead of only 3 weeks before the deadline. Too many local TV stations have already spent a bunch of money on new transmission equipment and jumped to full power DTV broadcasts to reverse course now.

It's scary to think what the computer industry would be like if the government had to grant approval every time a computing company wanted to change an operating system or move to a new generation of CPU chips. I think we would still be using i8086 PCs with monochrome screens if that was the case. Right now that industry is trying to transition to 64-bit native multiprocessor computing (many applications are still only 32-bit). If the government had to vote on it we would probably still only be inching out of 16-bit code just dying to go 32-bit.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-25-2009 05:40 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Chris Slycord
When large portions of the population only recently got the whole story since ads on TV previously only told them that digital was coming and to go to a website for more info, so anyone without internet didn't get the info.
Oh pleeze Bobby... thats totally not true. There have been hundreds of web sites for many years, this site included that have had the cutoff date posted. All the channels especially PBS has done a great job at getting the word out to all that watch. Personally I don't think the Government shouda handed out free coupons to anyone that wanted them... They should have been reserved for those that truely cannot afford one. So what if people have to listen to their radio for a while. It may do 6 million people some real good not to sit in front of the toobe for a while!!

Mark

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 01-25-2009 06:47 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark, you're responding to a comment made by Chris. Not me.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-25-2009 08:45 PM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Personally I don't think the Government shouda handed out free coupons to anyone that wanted them...
That's true, and also it's possible that some people got the boxes who don't need them. My parents, for example; they have cable so they don't need a box, but they got one anyway because they thought it was necessary.

I blame the educational TV spots for this. They should have trumpeted it loudly: IF YOU HAVE CABLE, YOU PROBABLY WON'T NEED A BOX instead of putting it in an asterisked fine-print at the end of the spots.

The idea that people "didn't know" about it is possible too, but would mainly apply to people who don't know about anything else in life either because they don't pay attention to anything. They should watch blank screens for awhile.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 01-26-2009 02:02 AM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Bobby Henderson
I figured it would be a good idea to point out this fact because the popular belief is that the DTV signals will not come in as well as the analog ones.
Here in Denver, DTV comes in much worse than analog. Whenever the wind blows, it cuts out. They are not running the DTV transmission at full power because those who have the authority to make such decisions clearly have micropenises.

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 퍼항시, 경상푹도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted 01-26-2009 02:23 AM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
There have been hundreds of web sites for many years, this site included that have had the cutoff date posted.
So you negate me saying that the online info isn't available/useful to people don't have internet by telling me that the info has been available online? Where in the world did that seem like a reasonable response?

And I was not saying that the commercials lacked the cutoff date; what I am saying is that the commercials, up until recently, had left out important information (like what the person needs to do to be digital ready). For instance, that survey I mentioned that the Federal Government conducted showing the misinformation out there.

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
All the channels especially PBS has done a great job at getting the word out to all that watch.
Again, I contend that this was only really done recently. I recall before the last couple months there had been a lot more ads that said the date, be ready, and get info at dtv2009.org.

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Personally I don't think the Government shouda handed out free coupons to anyone that wanted them... They should have been reserved for those that truely cannot afford one.
Imo, it's only fair that the government do this. They're the ones mandating the change and going to be paid a huge sum of money as a part of it.

quote: Bobby Henderson
Surveys are only as good as the level of honesty those being asked are willing to provide in their answers.
Forgive me if I trust a survey done by a reputable organization over your baseless assumption that the people surveyed are lying.

ps: If I'm coming off as angry right now, it's not at any of you. I had a crappy night and my back hurts.

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Anslem Rayburn
Master Film Handler

Posts: 476
From: Yuma, AZ, USA
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 01-26-2009 05:03 AM      Profile for Anslem Rayburn   Email Anslem Rayburn   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
All the channels especially PBS has done a great job at getting the word out to all that watch.
PBS isn't available on rabbit ears here. What good does the advertising on PBS do if those with an antenna don't get it? If you get PBS in this town, it means you have cable, and will not be impacted by the transition.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

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From: Forsyth, Montana
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 - posted 01-26-2009 09:19 AM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Plus, hardly anyone watches PBS. You can't get "Survivor" or "Lost" or Jay Leno or Regis and Kelly on PBS.

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Scott Jentsch
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: New Berlin, WI, USA
Registered: Apr 2003


 - posted 01-26-2009 10:05 AM      Profile for Scott Jentsch   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Jentsch   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I expect there to be much gnashing of teeth by those that are going to get caught unawares by the transition, but I don't understand why it is so difficult to get the word out?

TV stations ought to be able to put an overlay on top of their OTA broadcasts that basically says "If you're seeing this, you need to buy a converter box for your TV or purchase a TV capable of tuning digital TV signals, or you will not be able to tune in this and other stations after 2/17/2009. Please call xxx-xxx-xxxx for assistance"

Instead of running short 2 minute tests on a Tuesday evening once every month or so, this should be running non-stop since at least the beginning of the year. If they can do this with their annoying weather alerts that we're going to get a half inch of snow some time in the next two days, they should be able to do it for something as important as this.

The date should not be pushed off. They need to rip this band-aid off and get it over with. After all, the TV stores could use the revenue!

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 01-26-2009 10:07 AM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I, at least for one, am not going to buy any of this crap that the public didn't know about the DTV switch coming. The topic has been a news item for much of this decade. All of the major networks have already been spamming the "HD" thing in their prime time broadcasts for quite some time now.

The original cut off date for analog TV signals was back in May of 2006, but that got pushed back to a date only 22 days from now. There was quite a lot of news coverage about the deadline being pushed back over 3 years. That alone should have been enough of a hint to the public they would have to prepare to make some changes to their TV setups.

My opinion is at least some of those folks scoffed at the 3 year delay, laughed while calling the government incompetent and foolishly told themselves the DTV change would never happen.

quote: Joe Redifer
Here in Denver, DTV comes in much worse than analog. Whenever the wind blows, it cuts out. They are not running the DTV transmission at full power because those who have the authority to make such decisions clearly have micropenises.
That's just it. When the stations aren't running at full power they certainly will cut out more often. I'm only about 10 miles from the KSWO channel 7 Lawton tower and its signal will occaisionally get blocky and scrambled even in good weather. It's a low power signal, only about 30,000 watts. The 1 million watt signal from KFDX comes in great and their tower is clear on the other side of the Red River nearly an hour's drive to the South. My outdoor antenna isn't in perfect shape (the mast is missing a few spokes due to a nearby tree's limbs swatting it over the years). Yet I still pick up that Wichita Falls DTV station far better than I ever received its analog counterpart.

quote: Chris Slycord
Forgive me if I trust a survey done by a reputable organization over your baseless assumption that the people surveyed are lying.
Baseless? Here's some legitimate factors you must consider:

Many people will lie in unscientific surveys to protect their own self interests. People lie on their taxes. Many thousands defraud insurance companies and it goes on and on. When people have a motive to lie many will do so. Not everyone is honest.

A lot of cheap, crotchety old farts don't want the current analog standards of TV changing at all because they don't want to mess around with any new technology -especially if it runs the risk of costing them one red cent. They certainly have a motive to provide any negative spin on a survey about DTV.

There is another group of people ate up with conspiracy theory B.S. who believe the switch to DTV is just a plot to get everyone on pay TV service subscriptions. They either use that reason or fall back on the excuse that it's a big government giveaway to telecom corporations (despite the huge sums of money those companies paid to the government for the vacated spectrum).

Then there is the other factor that lots of people are just stupid when it comes to technology. They'll give answers without really understanding what they're talking about and even contradict themselves with the answers they provide in a survey.

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
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 - posted 01-26-2009 11:38 AM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Personally, I think it is all a bunch of BS. They should have left well-enough alone.

I have two TVs that have automatic channel changers (will switch channels at select times of the day, if you have a set schedule)...no converter box is going to retain that capability. Who would have thunk that the actual air waves were going to change?

Steve

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Chris Slycord
Film God

Posts: 2986
From: 퍼항시, 경상푹도, South Korea
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted 01-26-2009 12:31 PM      Profile for Chris Slycord   Email Chris Slycord   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Bobby Henderson
Not everyone is honest.
I'm well aware.

On the other hand, there's a HUGE difference between saying "Not everyone is honest" and "I'm dismissing the whole survey because some people aren't honest." Most people are, in fact, honest.

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