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Author Topic: Laser Projectors Peter Fagan Film Handler Posts: 17 From: Letterkenny, donegal, Ireland Registered: Aug 2012 posted 03-20-2019 04:19 PM                        Hi Guys.i am looking into the possibility of maybe going down the laser projector route sometime in the near future but am wondering if anyone has any experience with them. I am looking at the Christie Cp4325 RBD.Just wondering if anyone could tell me a bit more about them if anyone is actually using them yet & if so whats the light level like on screen lifespan of the bulb etc. I'd rather get info from people that are actually using them to see if there are worth investing in just yet or hold off yet for another while.Any info any of you guys have would be most welcome and Appreciated.  |  IP: Logged Stephan Shelley Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 854 From: castro valley, CA, usa Registered: Nov 2014 posted 03-20-2019 05:42 PM                     No direct experience for me yet but they are a 3P RGB laser projector. That means no laser 3D. You can do polarized if you want and all the issues it brings. They are passively cooled and the location they are installed in needs to stay at 75 degrees F or cooler. They do use liquid cooling but it is not refrigerated.  |  IP: Logged Paul Finn Film Handler Posts: 41 From: Bay City, MI Registered: Jan 2019 posted 03-21-2019 06:00 AM                     I have the same questions about, and any experience information with the Christie CP2320 RGB laser projector. How do these Christies compare to the equivalent LP projectors on the market-performance, expected longevity and cost? Thank you.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 03-21-2019 07:39 AM                     It's still a difficult topic, because nobody really has sufficient long-time experience to see if the claims from the manufacturers can be achieved. In general, I don't see a reason why an LP projector should have a shorter expected lifespan than a 3P projector. That being said, in general, the 3P projectors have sufficient headroom so they don't need to run close to capacity all the time. If you can light the screen up within specifications with just 50~60% of your power budget, this will surely save a lot of lifetime on your light source. Your entire projector will eventually benefit, because it doesn't need to run as hot. Now, the LP projectors are mostly not so impressive on the light output side. Also, a lot of light is still being lost by color filtering, which is needed to achieve at least P3 color space. In the end, the average LP projector will run much closer to maximum power than the average 3P projector. Therefore, I expect those LP machines not to last as long as the 3P machines. Some entry-level LP machines are already rated by the manufacturer for roughly 7 years, if you run about 2.5 shows a day on them. So, I'd say that for the more beefier LP machines, you should expect no more than 10 years, whereas the 3P machines that aren't running at 90% all the time will probably give you more like 15 years. If you don't like experiments and you don't have a gigantic screen to fill, Xenon is for now, still the safest, most predictable bet. Most Series 1 installs are now in the range of 10 years and the first Series 2 are also well on their way heading there. It looks like with proper maintenance, on average, they don't have a real problem getting there. The big danger for laser is that, when the light source fails before the expected lifetime and after your warranty expired, is that you're stuck with a repair that will most likely be more expensive than what the projector is still worth. In a xenon machine, about the most expensive thing that can break is the light engine. LPs and especially 3Ps now add an even more expensive element: The laser light source.  |  IP: Logged Alan Gouger Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 501 From: Bradenton, FL, USA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 03-21-2019 08:11 AM                        CinemaCon April 1st would be a good source to see the latest offerings. I see one company will show an RGB direct drop-in that replaces the existing lamp house in Xenon projectors.  |  IP: Logged Peter Fagan Film Handler Posts: 17 From: Letterkenny, donegal, Ireland Registered: Aug 2012 posted 03-21-2019 03:04 PM                        they way the film industry has changed in the last 10 years with the introduction of digital projectors & the retirement of the old 35mm projectors i think that Laser will come about a lot quicker than we think it will.I think its going to come down to a day when we will have no choice but to replace the current xenon projectors with Laser.What sounds good on paper though is completely different to the people that will be doing the day to day running & upkeep of them.which is mainly the few of us that are still lucky enough to be projectionists since the arrival of digital. I appreciate all the feedback from you guys.Its just that when we were looking at a new projector the subject of laser came up & i have no idea whether it would be worth getting or just holding off for now. Personally i would prefer to stay with the xenon but at the end of the day it will be the owner who has the final call.  |  IP: Logged Stephan Shelley Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 854 From: castro valley, CA, usa Registered: Nov 2014 posted 03-21-2019 04:52 PM                     Most exhibitors are not that ready to retool a 3rd time. So intrest in laser tech is limited. You will find laser projectors in the premium screens and I know Showcase Icon theatres are using LP projectors exclusively but these are mostly new construction. As mentioned all the series 1 projectors are 10 years old and replacement may become necessary in the near future.  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 03-21-2019 06:01 PM                     I'm a bit leery of the laser projectors for now. We have installed a few of them and they have had more problems than we see with xenon units. The image is great though, and most problems have been minor and not show-stoppers. For now, until the bugs have been worked out, I can't recommend a laser projector for a typical cinema. Wait a while. I'm not sure of the economics either. Yes, you need to replace xenon lamps regularly. But unless the projector dies before then, you will eventually need to service the laser light source as well. I've seen 10,000 hour life specifications for LP sources... what then? Is it just replacing the phosphor disk or do the lasers need to be replaced as well... can the source be rejuvenated or does it get replaced? You save on power and lamp change time costs but maintenance does not go to nil: regular maintenance is required and some of it is complex and time consuming. Is the TCO really much less than for xenon? The 3P/6P projectors give an excellent bright image but speckle is an issue. Has someone figured out a way to eliminate the speckle? Screen shakers seem like a primitive fix. LP projectors have very slight speckle if you put up a solid blue pattern, but red and green are the phosphor colors and thus have no speckle - green is the worst color for speckle in my experience.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 03-21-2019 06:29 PM                        quote: Alan Gouger I see one company will show an RGB direct drop-in that replaces the existing lamp house in Xenon projectors. I saw two companies offering laser conversions for xenon projectors last year: one that that had a direct lamphouse drop-in for a Barco C-series, and another that used an external laser unit connected to the projector by a fiber pipe. The price of both offerings led me to wonder who would want to spend not far off the cost of a brand new xenon projector of the sort that had been modified, to convert the light source in an older one that would be at high risk of light engine failure, ICP failure, etc. during the lifetime of the laser unit. The concept is technically elegant, but unless they can get the price of it down by a lot, I can't see it making any economic sense.  |  IP: Logged Harold Hallikainen Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 906 From: Denver, CO, USA Registered: Aug 2009 posted 03-21-2019 07:19 PM                        Since we are used to seeing the world lit with broad spectrum light, I wonder how person to person variation in color perception will be affected by narrow spectrum laser illumination. On speckle repmval by screen shaking an alternative would be projector shaking. Harold  |  IP: Logged Phil Ranucci Expert Film Handler Posts: 236 From: Carpinteria,CA, United States Registered: May 2006 posted 03-21-2019 08:06 PM                     We have a Barco LP conversion that has had a few teething problems. Picture is very nice, as Borat would say. If you look at all the parts they replaced, it might've been easier to swap the whole machine. Unless they've changed designs, the Barco LP conversion is not a direct lamphouse replacement  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 03-22-2019 12:37 AM                       quote: On speckle removal by screen shaking an alternative would be projector shaking. This has actually been tried and worked. Absurd as it might seem, shaking the lens has been found to work. A new product opportunity! Maybe we could breathe on it from a spare power amp into a suitable little speaker aimed at the lens. And all these years we used cast iron bases to keep from having the projector or lens shake, Life is funny sometimes.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 03-22-2019 04:25 AM                     And after that, what's next? Auditorium shaking? The 3P laser projectors usually combine their primary colors from multiple, smaller laser modules. I don't know about the feasibility, but I guess that if every module would be tuned to a slightly different frequency, the amount of interference due to coherence should be greatly reduced. Also, this should somewhat solve the issue for people who are less sensitive than average for a certain wavelength, as the spectrum per primary would be broadened.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 03-22-2019 06:12 AM                     They already use that approach (and others) for spectrum spreading, but it is a limited option, and especially for green, they usually need to use multiple schemes to get speckle below perception threshold - using screen shakers is the final defense line. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Paul Finn Film Handler Posts: 41 From: Bay City, MI Registered: Jan 2019 posted 03-24-2019 06:52 AM                     Is speckle an issue in all 3P and LP pictures? If not, when does it become a noticeable issue in the picture and requires correction? On screens larger than fifty feet (16m) wide or larger? What are the uncorrected speckle screen/picture size limitations? Thank you.  |  IP: Logged

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