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Author Topic: Upgrading from 5.1 to 7.1 Juan Jose Garcia Calvo Film Handler Posts: 64 From: Pedrajas de San Esteban, Spain Registered: May 2003 posted 06-01-2019 06:20 AM                     Hello everybody!. This summer we're planning to upgrade our little cinema theatre from 5.1 to 7.1 We actually have a QUBE QXPD server giving AES digital channels and 3 simple (dual) D/A converters. These converters feed 5.1 channels to our OLD DTS6AD processor. This processor only accepts 6 analog external channels. I brought sometime ago a DTS XD10P processor 8 channel capable. The 2 extra channels (7&8) are labelled as CenterR and CenterL in the webUI, but I think there is no problem with this, because I'm planning to feed it with the QUBE 11&12 channels that usually carry the RearSurrL and RearSurrR (If I'm not wrong). About the speakers, I will rewire and add two more speakers and an extra QSC USA900, but I have a doubt: Our actual surround layout (RSurr and LSurr) include not only the side speakers but some back wall mounted R / L speakers. These REAR speakers now will be feeded with the RearSurrL and RearSurrR channels, but… What's up with the 5.1 films? These REAR speakers will be un-used? In this case, 7.1 layout system will be worst than our actual layout. In this case, as the QUBE Server doesn't have audio channels routing capabilities, maybe a good idea would be add an stereo audio selector in the new extra QSC amplifier to select between the REAR SURROUND signals and the SIDE SURROUND signals (from the link output in the SIDE SURROUND amplifier. This way, I can feed the 5.1's surround signal to the back wall speakers when contents is 5.1. I must slect it manually and of course this option will be chosen attending to the feature's encoded audio system, not to the trailers… Any advice or any objections? Regards!!  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 06-01-2019 07:19 AM                     A 7.1 capable sound processor will give you a 5.1 and a 7.1 preset. The 5.1 one will have a different routing inside: the side surround signal would be routed to the back and the overall surround level adjusted accordingly. The DTS is an Ultra Stereo JSD-80 if not mistaken. I think it may be flexible enough to do what you want but it’s been a long time since I played with one of those. Also if not mistaken the DTS comes with the AES board as standard so you should be able to wire it directly to the server.  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 06-01-2019 09:25 AM                     Edit: out of curiosity I went back to the XD10P setup software and I cannot really see a way to switch back to 5.1 unless you put something together yourself. The routing is not the end of the world, it's the level that concerns me - when back to 5.1 you are supposed to lower the output a bit as now your side surrounds are doing 82dBC but you are adding the back speakers which will raise the level a bit (2-3dB).  |  IP: Logged Stephan Shelley Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 854 From: castro valley, CA, usa Registered: Nov 2014 posted 06-01-2019 01:56 PM                     If you can get hold of the right person at QSC they may be able to help you. QSC now owns the USL line and I think there is an upgrade for the JSD-80 to do 7.1 but you need to talk to an old USL person at QSC that knows the JSD-80. Harold who posts here often is an USL person and might know.  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 06-01-2019 03:49 PM                     Indeed it's on their ftp! I wasn't aware of that. JSD80 FTP  |  IP: Logged Harold Hallikainen Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 906 From: Denver, CO, USA Registered: Aug 2009 posted 06-01-2019 03:52 PM                        Though I wrote the firmware for the JSD-80 a LONG time ago, I do not remember the details. I suggest contacting CinemaTechSupport@qsc.com . There is GUI and firmware for 7.1 at http://ftp.uslinc.com/Products/JSD-80/Software/ Harold  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 06-02-2019 05:06 PM                     For the average software programmer, 5 years is already 10 frameworks, 7 programming languages and 4 different development project management philosophies later. quote: Marco Giustini The DTS is an Ultra Stereo JSD-80 if not mistaken. I think it may be flexible enough to do what you want but it’s been a long time since I played with one of those. I'm not sure about this, but didn't the DTS6AD come with DTS-branded firmware? I didn't know you could simply replace it with stock JSD-80 firmware.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 06-03-2019 07:01 AM                     The DTS-6AD was DTS all of the way. It was the XD-10P that was a JSD processor in disguise. There were differences and restrictions on the DTS version. The software was slightly different but I know you could connect to the DTS one with the JSD80 one. Surround 7.1 was a later software version that may not have ever been incorporated into the DTS version. Tom Atkinson at QSC would probably be your best resource as he was present at USL during that time and would have fielded those sorts of calls.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 06-03-2019 06:01 PM                     The DTS XD10P was an OEM version of the JSD-80. It lacked some hardware options, but supported the two 8ch modes. It was missing the S/P-DIF / AC3 decoder board. I service one location with an DTS XD10P using the latest version of the JSD-80 config software. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Juan Jose Garcia Calvo Film Handler Posts: 64 From: Pedrajas de San Esteban, Spain Registered: May 2003 posted 06-06-2019 03:54 AM                     Thank you everybody for your answers. I contacted with USL/QSC people and they told me that (of course) they don't support a DTS device, but they tell me that using JSD80 firmware on a DTS XD10P is possible as they saw this before. The question now is what do I need to install first? Carsten said that windows JSD80 software "see" a XD10P processor, so the first is to try this. If this works, there are different firmwares for the different modules: - PIC Firmware - Matrix Firmware - NR Firmware - EQ Firmware Any idea about the installing order? This processor have an extraíble SD card module to store configurations and restore files. Maybe it could be a good idea to save this SD card and install a new one to make "experiments". Another question: Where can I get a DCP 7.1 audio test clip with standard channels configuration to play it endless to see if every channel is being played in the side it must be being played? Something like a voice saying: "left screen channel" encoded in the standard Left screen channel, and the same thing for the rest of the 7.1 channels. Maybe I can do this myself using DCP'o'matic from an MP4 7.1 source (or similar)... Regards!  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 06-06-2019 06:28 AM                     I can't help you on the firmware installing order. But regarding the test files, I think there is a 7.1 CPL in here: http://isdcf.com/SMPTE-DCP-Content/SMPTE_TST-B1B2Q_S_EN-EN-CCAP_51-HI-VI_2K_ISDCF_20161007_TCF_SMPTE.zip With those you can also test your VI/HI channels. quote: Steve Guttag The DTS-6AD was DTS all of the way. It was the XD-10P that was a JSD processor in disguise. Yep, I mixed up the models there. The 6AD is/was obviously one of the native DTS units with DTS disc reading capabilities.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 06-06-2019 06:28 AM                     Harold should be able to send you an FTP link to access all the JSD80 documentation and software. Oh, he did already...just read through the docs. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Harold Hallikainen Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 906 From: Denver, CO, USA Registered: Aug 2009 posted 06-06-2019 09:12 AM                        Firmware install order does not make any difference on the JSD-80. The "personality module" is a custom EEPROM module, not an SD card. Harold  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 06-06-2019 10:15 AM                     The DTS XD10P unlike the USL JSD80 doesnt support a mix of 5.1 and 7.1 The USL if configured to 7.1 does a sort of EX for the rear wall  |  IP: Logged Jim Cassedy Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1661 From: San Francisco, CA Registered: Dec 2006 posted 06-06-2019 11:24 AM                     quote: e can I get a DCP 7.1 audio test clip with standard channels configuration If you have access to the DolbyCustomer website, they have exactly the type of 7.1 test clip you are looking for, which voices the channels. It repeats twice, but you can loop it indefinitely in your server. Or, send me a PM and I have several different versions of 5.1 & 7.1 test files I can send to you if you give me your e-mail address. (I tried through the board but your e-mail seems to be blocked)  |  IP: Logged

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