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Topic: Moving prints is killing my back

Andy Muirhead
Master Film Handler

Posts: 323
From: Galashiels, Scotland
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 01-17-2002 08:13 PM

We are an independent 4 screen cinema. Generally we have to move prints about for maximum effect. Sometimes we show as much as 12 prints on our four screens. So naturally a lot of shifting is expected, although now it seems it's really taking it's toll on my back. Small films are ok but it's the big nine+ reelers that do it. Lifting is ok but carrying is the problem. If you imagine carrying a biggie like Harry Potter or Rings under one arm - you wouldn't even carry 9 reels in the cans at one time, with both hands.

I have to find some solution to SAFELY move prints, i've had enough of this back pain, which can last a week from moving one print (damn that harry potter!).

I'd be most interested to hear from other UK film-techers about their practices, especially health and safety aspects.

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Gerard S. Cohen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 975
From: Forest Hills, NY, USA
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 01-17-2002 08:55 PM

I worked for a time in a 14-plex where all projectors were in a straight line. One of the projectionists made over a dozen "pizza-platters" of beaverboard, and got the owner to purchase several steel
hospital-type rubber-tired tables. By taking up a show onto a beaverboard covered platter, one could remove the brain and slide the
show onto the table and onto another platter stack. Usually it was done by two projectionists, but I imagine one could do it using middle
platters if he had to. We didn't mind switching shows, because our contract awarded a tidy sum for each switch. But the men later exchanged that perk for a higher hourly wage in the new contract.

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-17-2002 10:05 PM

I would recommend you obtain help from someone while moving prints. Everyone is entitled to a safe working enviroment. It is very easy to permanently damage your back while moving prints, especially if you have to mount and dismount them by yourself.

Been there, and the damage has been done.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 01-17-2002 10:25 PM

Whenever possible, made-up prints should have TWO people to move them between platters. Handling a full show alone puts awkward strains on the body (especially the lower back) because the load is so unbalanced. A three hour show weighs about 80 pounds (36 kilograms), well above the recommended individual repetitive lifting guidelines in most health and safety standards. As discussed in previous threads, moving a print alone also risks spilling the film on the floor --- like Russian Roulette, 5 times out of 6 you get away with it, but there's a "bloody" mess to clean off the floor the sixth time.
http://www.osha-slc.gov/OshDoc/Fact_data/FSNO93-09.html
http://www.sentry.com/Back_Injuries.html
http://www.ci.mil.wi.us/citygov/health/sboh/back_injuries.htm

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John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-17-2002 10:49 PM

Thanks for the re-enforcement, John. I had that just in mind when I answered the post. I think 80 Pounds extended lifting is equivilant to almost a ton of pressure on some of the lower back discs. That's what the doctor told me, anyway. Of course, that depends on how far the 80- pounds is from the body.

All I can say is it will mess a person up very badly! I would recommend you look at John's links above. It could serve as a "wake up" call.

Paul

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-17-2002 11:08 PM

My vote is with Paul and John. Two people. Period. Life is too short to put up with back problems you don't have to have.

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Zach Zagar
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Jefferson City, MO
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 01-17-2002 11:44 PM

I think, personally, I would rather have a sore back for the next 50 years of my life than to have to put together a dropped print... I've had to clean up one, in my entire life, 4 years ago, I don't want to ever do it again. Either way, bad back, or extra work, good enough reasons for two print movers.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 01-17-2002 11:46 PM

Hmmm....maybe that's why my back hurts. I don't move prints by myself anymore, but I used to. I didn't like to, but sometimes I had to. I have always insisted on someone helping me whenever possible.

As far as making it easier, Regal has carts in their booths the width of a platter and the hight of the bottom platter deck. We also have what we sometimes call "donuts." Sounds to me like that's what Gerard was talking about. But I never thought of taking up a show directly onto the donut. We would always slide the print onto the donut and slide the donut onto the cart.

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This one time, at Projection Camp, I stuck a xenon bulb....

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John T. Hendrickson, Jr
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 889
From: Freehold, NJ, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 01-18-2002 07:31 PM

My booth policy is two operators moving a print AT ALL TIMES, on the pizza board with the print clamped. NO EXCEPTIONS! If a print is excessively large (eg: Lord of the Rings), the last two reels are backed off the platter and moved on a 6000' reel seperately to reduce the total weight.

Does this save time? Hell no. Does this save prints! Yep. We are not in business to save time in the booth. Do it any other way in my booth and you're toast.

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-18-2002 08:30 PM

And, John's method also saves you from the legal hassles from the Department of Labor and Industries, as well as medial claims from personnel injured on the job.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 01-18-2002 11:00 PM

Quote: "Do it any other way in my booth and you're toast."

Damn I wish I could say that about a lot of things in "my" booth. But that's another whole rant....

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This one time, at Projection Camp, I stuck a xenon bulb....

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Andy Muirhead
Master Film Handler

Posts: 323
From: Galashiels, Scotland
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 01-20-2002 08:29 PM

Thanks for all your help.

I have now been released from moving prints, until further notice.
One thing i must say is, i brought this to the attention of my Film-Tech bud's at the same time i brought the problem to my employer's, who have been excellent in their response, which was to withdraw me immediately from any lifting and carrying duties.

We are now in the R&D process of developing a 'clamp' which will enable two persons to safely carry a film of up to 3 hours, safely, securely and speedily!

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Wes Hughes
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 175
From: Raleigh, NC, USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 01-20-2002 11:47 PM

The only print I have ever damaged while moving (in nearly 15 years of operating platters) was a print that two of us were moving. Not trying to sound snotty, but I feel I can move (utilizing steel clamps) a print more safely alone.

As for actually moving them, don't carry them under your arm...put them on your shoulder. If they are really big and you don't have to worry about running into anything in a small booth, bend over about 20 degrees from straight up put the roll onto your back holding the center ring with two hands behind your head. When you get the roll to its destination you can bend over 90 degrees and back up, sliding it onto an middle platter. I know it sounds awkward, and if you have clamps that don't properly fit the roll, or a loose roll it is WAY more dangersous that way....but it always works well for me.

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Jason Black
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1723
From: Myrtle Beach, SC, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-26-2002 01:51 PM

I like the idea of having a cart to help move prints. Would the person who mentioned this please send me (via private email) a pic of the setup you use? I'd like ot develop some sort of qizmo for use at my theatre to aid in the movement of film from one house to the next as needed.

On a footnote, I've never had a serious problem (hear me knocking?) using the traditional clamp, underarm/headlock method. However, I rarely move prints anymore, and I'd like for my guys to have a better way to do it.

Thanks!

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The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese!

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Darren Solomon
Film Handler

Posts: 28
From: unknown
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 01-31-2002 12:38 AM

I too have begun to have more back problems with these new longer movies that have come out and would like to see this device that can cart off a print directly from the platters. Please send me pics and how I can get one. I even have a lobby that I have to cut across to get to the upstairs 2nd Booth with a print. Such a big pain.
Thanks

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