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Author Topic: Kodak in crisis?
Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000


 - posted 10-23-2003 05:08 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Eastman Kodak investors are holding crisis talks amid the continuing slump in the company's share price. Link to story.
quote:
Kodak, the world's largest manufacturer of photographic film, is in crisis.
by Mark Gregory, BBC World Service business reporter.

The growing popularity of digital cameras that do not use traditional film has severely dented the market Kodak has dominated for more than a century.

And the company's net profits have slipped to $122m (£73m) for the July to September quarter, marking a 63% drop when compared with the same period a year earlier.

In an effort to sort it out, a group of rebel investors who control about a quarter of the company's shares are meeting in New York on Wednesday.

The investors want to find a way to reverse a plunge in the company share price that has been caused by both the falling profits and by concerns about the group's strategy going forward.

Digital limbo

Last month Kodak unveiled plans to invest $3bn to increase its presence in the area of digital technology.

This, the company believes, would counteract a sharp fall in demand for its traditional products in the world's rich countries - that is, in the markets that matter.

But such plans have infuriated some investors whose dividend payments have been cut by 72% to pay for the diversification.

The rebel investors say Kodak is taking too many risks.

Staying put

The investors want Kodak to avoid head to head competition with established electronics giants like Sony, Canon and Hewlett Packard, which have big leads in digital imaging.

They are worried that Kodak will spend too much on buying up other companies to beef up its position in an area its unfamiliar with.

After all, they insist: Film may be in decline, but its still provides Kodak with sizeable profits.

Besides, in some parts of the developing world demand for film is actually rising.

Rebel investors say the company should stick to the business it knows.

But Kodak is mindful of the fate of the instant picture group Polaroid, which went bust two years ago after failing to move with the times.

The group is desperate to avoid a similar fate.

"Our third-quarter results reinforce the rationale behind the strategy we unveiled to our investors on 25 September," said chairman and chief executive Daniel Carp.

After all, history is littered with examples of firms that were performing brilliantly with one type of technology but failed to make the transition to the next.


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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
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 - posted 10-23-2003 08:33 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here's the information directly from Kodak:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/corp/pressReleases/pr20031022-03.shtml

http://www.kodak.com/US/plugins/acrobat/en/corp/investorCenter/pr20031022-03.pdf

If you look at the results of Kodak's Research and Development, there's a nice mix of film and digital imaging:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/corp/researchDevelopment/techProdHighlights.shtml

Here's what Richard Sehlin, Chief Technology Officer for Kodak's Entertainment Imaging has to say about the future:

http://www.kodak.com/country/US/en/motion/products/v2/sehlin.shtml

About 70% of our R&D budget is dedicated to advancing FILM technology.

Within the next few months, Kodak will introduce several additional new Kodak VISION2 films, expanding on the innovations introduced with Kodak VISION2 500T Color Negative Film 5218.

Kodak just introduced two NEW B&W camera films, supporting filmmakers creativity:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/products/bw/newBWFilms.shtml

Kodak is also investing in developing "Hybrid" technologies (e.g., scanning, recording, image management, etc.), as well as in Digital Cinema:

http://www.kodak.com/go/dcinema

Other companies (e.g., Sony) are facing challenges too:

http://www.forbes.com/business/newswire/2003/10/20/rtr1115288.html

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

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From: Loma Linda, CA
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 - posted 10-23-2003 09:58 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
One thing which struck me about the BBC article was that it didn't mention film for moving image use at all (and as we know, that sector of the industry isn't going to 'go digital' in anything like the same timescale as still photography) - a layman reading it would think that all Kodak made was film for still cameras...

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John Pytlak
Film God

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From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
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 - posted 10-23-2003 10:21 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
One thing which struck me about the BBC article was that it didn't mention film for moving image use at all (and as we know, that sector of the industry isn't going to 'go digital' in anything like the same timescale as still photography) - a layman reading it would think that all Kodak made was film for still cameras...

Yes, the press often "gets it wrong" because they "see" only that side of Kodak by what's on store shelves. There's more to the story:

InfoImaging

Kodak Business Units

Prolific Inventors

Kodak Investors Information

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Thomas Procyk
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 10-26-2003 02:44 PM      Profile for Thomas Procyk   Email Thomas Procyk   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Kodak should develop a digital camera that can print to film.

The same concept as the Advantix camera with the LCD preview screen, except have the ability to save the pictures digitally as well as on film. A switch at the top could let you select "Film" or "Digital Only" so you can decide whether something is important enough to have prints of, or just a digital copy. You could also avoid wasting a shot on something you weren't sure of. I would certainly buy one of these "Hybrid" cameras to avoid carrying around a film AND a digital camera with me.

Now I know most all photo finishing places offer prints from digital, but most people don't have the time to sift through 100+ digital pictures they've taken, decide what they want, put it on a disk or CD and take it over there, not to mention most people don't know how to.

What do you think?
=TMP=

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Stephen Furley
Film God

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From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
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 - posted 10-26-2003 03:11 PM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, it's been possible for a some time, on medium and large format cameras, where you can mount film or digital backs at will. I think it would be more difficult to do in a low-cost consumer camera, at an acceptable cost.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

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From: Lawton, OK, USA
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 - posted 10-26-2003 08:38 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would not really be interested in buying a camera that recorded a picture digitally only to "print" it to film later. It might be a neat concept, but the practical terms of it make no sense. Perhaps a digital camera might be nice to "proof" or test an image before doing a film exposure. But if I am going to shoot something on film, I want the entire process happening analog, light to lens to film emulsion with no digital step in between.

Most digital cameras use a CMOS chip (while some use a CCD) to "see" a digital image and record it to memory. The resolution of a CMOS chip is finite and would not create any more image data by digitally recording to film than it would by simply storing the image onto a flash memory card. In fact, you would likely get a fair amount of image degradation in the process. The only difference I see in this is just added film development costs. It would be better to save that money, buy some good glossy photo paper and print out the photos using an inkjet printer.

Here's the film/digital combo camera I would like: a 35mm film camera with all the normal bells and whistles of a good SLR and a removeable digital CMOS back that can insert in place of a roll of film.

Granted, creating such a thing would be pretty tricky given the different exposure areas of 8-perf 35mm still camera film versus the tiny size of a CMOS chip. But if large format cameras can switch between analog and digital function why should 35mm be any different? Photographers can invest in really good lenses and make great improvements to both digital and film images.

This kind of insertable CMOS system would also be a good route for varying features to make certain models more affordable versus something more high end. You could have a single chip CMOS setup with a certain level of resolution versus a pretty high end model sporting sharper resolution spread across 3 CMOS chips.

Actually, I'm surprised we haven't seen much in the way of 3CMOS cameras. All digital camera chips really only see a black and white image. Filters are applied to specific areas of the chip to see either the Red, Green or Blue component of color and then the chip interpolates a full color image from that. It seems to work okay in digital still cameras, but not very good at all in consumer CCD video cameras. That's why all professional video cameras have a 3CCD system. It would stand to reason that some digital camera makers might want to try to market a 3CMOS camera with more accurate color than a typical 1CMOS camera can provide. With interchangeable backs, a company could offer such an upgrade route without pinning the entire model line down on it.

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Steve Kraus
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From: Chicago, IL, USA
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 - posted 10-26-2003 10:55 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Does Kodak actually manufacture digital cameras or simply contract for their construction, and if so who makes the imaging chips?

Maybe they should have hung onto Eastman Chemical.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

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From: Lawton, OK, USA
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 - posted 10-27-2003 12:16 AM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Kodak's digital cameras are definitely outsourced. The notice on the bottom of my Kodak DX6340 "EasyShare" camera says "Made in China, Designed in Japan for Eastman Kodak Company, Rochester, NY." I'm not going to take apart the camera to check the markings on individual components. There may be some TI or Motorola stuff in there (like you would find in a lot of Japanese branded consumer electronics gear). But I would be willing to bet items like the main CMOS sensor were probably made in Chinese chip fabs. The consumer digital camera market is a little too price driven rather than quality driven for there to be a 100% American made or mostly American made product.

The cutesy factor is another problem with digital cameras. Aside from my fantasies over 35mm/digital still interchangeability or 3CMOS/3CCD still cameras, I would like to see a return to developing digital cameras that had something better than PITIFULLY SHORT BATTERY LIFE.

Battery life in nearly all digital cameras just outright sucks! No points higher than that at all. Why is it that my little palmcorder can take batteries that can last 3 or 4 hours while there just isn't much of anything on the still market that lasts more than a few minutes? When one considers the huge and ever growing capacities of flash memory chips on the market, it is easy for someone to sit through their kid's soccer game and literally shoot 200 or 300 pictures. But you wind up missing a bunch of action if you are constantly rumaging through your camera bag trying to find more charged AA batteries.

I don't know if Sony still offers camcorder style batteries with any of their Mavica line of cameras. Our shop used to have a model that used camcorder style batteries. It even had a 14X optical zoom lens with optical image stabilization. Sony doesn't make a camera like that anymore. You put those kind of features on a camera that can take a 3.1 megapixel or higher rez image and you'll have a absolute winner of a digital camera.

If Kodak wants to improve their digital camera business, I suggest in the strongest possible terms they incorporate some kind of external socket where you can attach a camcorder battery. I know this thread was really about Kodak's sagging film business, but this battery angle can be a money making opportunity for them if they approach it right.

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John Pytlak
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 - posted 10-27-2003 05:55 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sourcing depends upon the camera model. Kodak developed and makes the high-end imaging chips:

Kodak Digital Sensors

DCSPro14n Camera

16 Megapixel Digital Camera Back

Kodak Consumer Cameras

Adding some links about improving battery life:

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/publications/urg00039c12s8.jhtml

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/publications/tib4324.jhtml

On-line "Firmware Updates" for some Kodak digital camera models offer improved "power management" over the original software loaded into the camera:

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/software/dx3600/dx3600Software.jhtml

[ 10-27-2003, 12:35 PM: Message edited by: John Pytlak ]

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Steve Kraus
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 - posted 10-27-2003 01:23 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I haven't had any problems with short battery life on my Olympus C2020Z which takes 4 AA, normally NMH. Maybe my expectations are different. The view screen backlight illumination is probably the biggest drain. I've had it now almost 4 years and like it alot.

Back when I got it, Olympus thoughtfully included not only a set of NMH cells and charger but also a set of conventional alkaline cells on the theory that the rechargable cells would need charging but the buyer (or giftee) would want to start using it right away. They've probably eliminated that on the succeeding models as price competition has intensified.

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

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From: Annapolis, MD
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 - posted 10-27-2003 02:12 PM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Olympus also started using these super-long-life batteries..CR-V3. They seem to last a REAL long time.

Steve

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John Pytlak
Film God

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From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
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 - posted 10-27-2003 02:59 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Olympus also started using these super-long-life batteries..CR-V3. They seem to last a REAL long time.

Many Kodak digital cameras also take the CRV3 Lithium Batteries. They definitely have an advantage over other battery types. Trouble is, they are not rechargeable.

Internet Review of Kodak MAX CRV3 Lithium Battery

Amazon.com review

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
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 - posted 10-27-2003 03:33 PM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Trouble is, they are not rechargeable.
Hey the landfills need disposables too! [Wink]

Steve

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
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 - posted 10-27-2003 08:40 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My Kodak camera came with a CRV type battery as well. And those types do last longer than traditional AA batteries. Perhaps up to four or five times as long. Still, the life of a CRV battery is quite a bit shorter than one charge of a Li-ion rechargeable camcorder style battery.

Unfortunately, for some of the types of things I photograph such as early evening shots of new signs lit in all their glory, I need the visual feedback on the LCD screen. And the LCD screen drinks battery juice very fast. I can't just leave the view finder turned off since I use the "point and shoot" mode for those low light purposes. You have to bracket shots in those conditions, but you have to use the LCD screen to set up your different exposure and aperture settings. I have to do this quickly since the ambient light of early evening disappears very fast. But it really turns into a drag when you have to unscrew the camera from the tripod to drop in another pair of AA NiMH batteries.

Of course my case is a special circumstance. But I know (and have seen) lots of people run into similar jams trying to take photos of their kid's high school football game and other stuff like that. A 512MB SD card will last you the duration of a football game. It is a shame we can't have a digital still camera battery that can do the same, especially when camcorder batteries can do the trick.

It is nice to learn Kodak makes its CMOS sensors.

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