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Author Topic: PC data to Mac via Firewire Nate Lehrke Master Film Handler Posts: 396 From: Denver, CO Registered: Oct 2002 posted 10-24-2003 08:54 PM                     I have a Windows XP Laptop and a Mac with OSX or OS9.2. I bought a FireWire Notebook Adapter and a 1394 Firewire cord. I installed the Notebook card in the Laptop and have the two computers linked via the cord. How do I access the info? All I want is the info on the Laptop available to the MAC. Do I need some software installed? Any help would be appreciated??  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 10-24-2003 09:11 PM                     This is the first time I've ever heard of networking a Mac to a PC using Firewire. I mean, I'm not a big expert on IEEE-1394, but it just doesn't seem very possible at all. It doesn't even sound possible doing it PC to PC or Mac to Mac. You need some kind of networking protocol, and I'm pretty sure Firewire doesn't support that. Firewire is pretty much a computer to device type of standard. Now if you had something like a little 4 port router, you could network your WinXP laptop and Mac desktop machine together, and even share Internet access. It is pretty easy to set up OS X to "see" Windows PCs on the same network. For the classic OS 9.x, I think you need an extra app like PC/MacLAN.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-24-2003 09:23 PM                     Yes, it can be done. First, on the Mac you'll need to get a kernel extension called, "IP over FireWire". Download it from Apple.com Notice that it's a preview release. This little ditty isn't quite ready for prime time yet. Also, I believe you'll need to have developer's tools installed. Third, it's OS X software, not OS 9/Classic. Install the IPoFW software on any Mac you wish to network via FireWire. Second, you'll need to know if XP can do IPoFW. If so, you're in like Flynn. If not, you're screwed unless you know how to write device drivers and/or system extsnsions for XP. Do both your computers have ethernet? That would be the simplest way to do this. Just plug an ethernet cable between the two computers. Activate file sharing on both comptuers. Go to the GO > Connect... menu in OS X and you'll be able to connect to the PC from the Mac in the usual way. It doesn't matter which flavor of ethernet cable you're using. It can be either a patch cable or a crossover cable. The ethernet port on the Mac will detect and switch as necessary. If you need cross-platform sharing software for the Mac, don't bother with PC/MacLAN. Check out Thursby Software. A program called "DAVE" will allow you to network and file share between PC and Mac. Another program called "ADmitMac" will allow you to connect your Mac to an Active Director or Windows NT domain. [ 10-24-2003, 10:32 PM: Message edited by: Randy Stankey ]  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 10-24-2003 10:43 PM                        I've firewired data to and from my Mac to Nate's Mac (before it was his) in the past, so Mac to Mac is no problem. One Mac just shows up on the other Mac as an external drive (along with any desktop clutter). Transfer rates are FAST. Ethernet would probably be the best way. I'm sure I put 10.2 on your Mac, Nate. Do what Randy says as far as the ethernet cable. With OS X it works FAR better than that crusty Dave bastard, who you know I hate. Only dare to use Dave if you use OS 9. Randy, are you sure the Mac will recognize a non-crossover cable being used for crossover purposes? Nate's Mac is a 450Mhz G4 AGP. It was one of the first generation of G4's or so. Check dis out yo: I am in OS X right now and I went GO > Connect to Server from the desktop and look at all of these people's computer's that show up: I can't access any of them, but obviously they are somehow visable (JOESPC is my Windows 2000 box).  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 10-24-2003 11:01 PM                     I think the G4 Powerbooks were the first to sense crossover or straight ethernet cables. Not all can do that. I don't think my iBook can do it and I KNOW that my Flower Power iMac and B&W G3 cannot.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-24-2003 11:50 PM                     White iBooks with dual USB ports and a 10/100 ethernet port can auto-configure for crossover or patch cables. As far as I know, all 10/100 ehternet controllers after that time and all 10/100/1000 ethernet controllers in the new Powerbooks do it as well. Older iMacs, iBooks or Powerbooks do not have it. However, only ONE out of two computers need to have auto-configuring ethernet for the scheme to work. Agreed, Joe! Dave should be a last resort for use when you only have OS 9. OS X has it built in. Also remember that "FireWire Target Disk Mode" is different from "IP Over FireWire". With Target Disk Mode, you shut down one computer and restart while holding down the letter "T" on the keyboard. This will abort the usual boot process and turn the computer into the equivalent of an external FireWire hard drive. IP Over FireWire is a set of system extensions that makes your FireWire port into the functional equivalent of a 480 Mbps ethernet port. IPoFW gives your FW port the ability to use TCP/IP, AFP, HTTP, FTP, SSH, etc. just the same as your ethernet. Be aware that this software is a PREVIEW version meant for developers to use when writing programs that will use the eventual public version later on. It's also a kind of public beta so that Apple can work out some bugs, etc. In the documentation that comes with the download it says, "Do not use for mission-critical purposes." There are also some funky tricks to getting it to work right but I expect these to be worked out when the final release comes out. I don't think XP has IPoFW, nor do I know of software that can make it work for XP. I don't do Windows, however. I could be wrong. Joe did give me an idea: What is there to prevent you from putting your Mac into Target Disk Mode and then plugging it into a PC. For all intents and purposes, the computer has morphed itself into an ordinary disk drive. The only thing I can think of that would hinder it is the differences in disk formats. I know that Macs can read the PC's file format (via a kernel extension) but I don't know if the PC can read the Mac's HFS+ format. It could be worth trying. What's the worst that could happen? The drive just won't mount, no? Part of the reason those computers show up in your "Go > Connect..." menu is that those computers were once available for sharing on your network. You might not be able to connect to them if they have "fallen off" the network or if the person who owns the computer has deactivated file sharing. Don't forget that the password could have been changed sinc you last hooke up to that computer too. There is still some funkiness in the networking system, even though Apple claims everything is working OK. Sometimes, when I connect to the network at Mercyhurst my other computer at home will still show up on the list even though it's not really there. Sometimes, the reverse will happen after I come home at night. If I try to connect to a computer that has "fallen off" the network my system will seem to hang until it determines that it can't find the remote computer. Other times, I won't be able to connect to a computer that SHOULD be there but doesn't show up on the list. I think there is some latency in the updating of the "netinfo" database. (Is that what it's called? Whatever it is... That list of remote devices that the comptuer keeps so that it can find them again.) To be honest, I don't really have much call for networking my Mac to the PC network. I do it occasionally and it works well ehough when I need it. It could be a little "smoother" though. Maybe I just need to study up on some details?  |  IP: Logged Nate Lehrke Master Film Handler Posts: 396 From: Denver, CO Registered: Oct 2002 posted 10-25-2003 12:21 AM                     quote: activate file sharing on both comptuers. Go to the GO > Connect... menu in OS X and you'll be able to connect to the PC from the Mac in the usual way. Could you elaborate on that a bit. I have the two computers connected via the crossover cable and the Laptop appears to have enabled the connection but what exactly do I need to do in the GO > Connect... ????  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 10-25-2003 12:58 AM                        When you are in the Desktop of OS X (with no other programs running), under the "GO" menu at the top of the screen, select "Connect to Server". See if you can find your Windows PC. If your Windows machine has file sharing on then you should be able to see it on the Mac. You can click into it and begin screwing everything up. You can create a "shortcut" once the disk mounts on your dektop (highlight the disk and press Apple+M), so you just double click that and there you are. Also remember the rule of messing with another computer via a network connection: in this scenario you MUST (no exceptions) implant a virus or screw things up bad on the computer you are accessing. This is what makes the internet so great, so don't let us down. Also, if you choose to try and boot the Mac into firewire taget mode by holding "T" as it boots, it will probably appear on the PC..... BUT BE VERY CAREFUL because the PC will not recognize the drive and it will probably want to format the Mac, thus erasing EVERYTHING fo'ever. I recommend some crack cocaine to help you through this issue.  |  IP: Logged Nate Lehrke Master Film Handler Posts: 396 From: Denver, CO Registered: Oct 2002 posted 10-25-2003 01:09 AM                     quote: If your Windows machine has file sharing on then you should be able to see it on the Mac. I am guessing that my Windows machine doesn't have file sharing enabled because when I goto the GO > CONNECT, the only thing that comes up is MAC - OS - G4  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 10-25-2003 05:18 AM                     Windows XP is claimed to be able to do IP over 1394, but as we only have about four XP amchines, we are nearly all Windows 2000, and none of those has 1394 installed, I cannot test it yet. I should have a XP machine with 1394 in a couple of weeks or so, and I'll try it then. Mac OS X to Windows 2000 over Ethernet works fine, I do it all the time. Nate, Right-click 'My Network Places', select properties, right-click the network connection you want to use, select 'Properties' of that, and check that 'File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft Networks' is in the list of installed components. If it isn't, install it, you will probably need the Windows CD to do this. If it is already installed, make sure that the check box next to it is checked, to enable it for that connection. Before you try to get higher level protocols working, check that you have IP connectivity between the machines by opening terminal on the Mac and ping it IP address of the Windows machine. If this doesn't work, then nothing else will. If you are just connecting the two machines together, with no DHCP server, you will probably have to mauually configure both with static IP settings. Windows machines in this situation can configure themselves using APIPA with addresses in the 169.254.0.0 network, but I don't think Macs can. I've just remembered where there is a laptop with XP and 1394, it's locked in someones desk at the moment, but they are back in on Monday, and we have in iMac in the department for testing purposes, I'll give it a try next week.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-25-2003 09:36 AM                     quote: Joe Redifer: ...BUT BE VERY CAREFUL because the PC will not recognize the drive and it will probably want to format the Mac, thus erasing EVERYTHING fo'ever.... I assumed that since Nate was a big boy now that he'd know not to do those things. How to network from the Mac? Couldn't be easier! First go to your APPLE > PREFERENCES... > SHARING pref pane. and activate file sharing. Second, click out to the FINDER. (You can have other programs running, just not active.) Choose the menu, GO > CONNECT TO SERVER... Or if you like command keys, press "<CMD> K". You will get this dialog: All shared computers on your network, be they Windows or Mac will show up here. Choose your remote computer to "hook up" with, type in the username/password and you should be ready to rock! Yes, Macs will self-assign a 169.x.x.x IP address if the need to.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 10-25-2003 09:57 AM                        quote: Randy wrote: I assumed that since Nate was a big boy now that he'd know not to do those things You obviously don't know Nate! (J/K Nate! ) Good instructions, by the way. Seeing the screenshots ALWAYS helps.  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 10-27-2003 11:23 AM                     I tried IP over 1394 this afternoon. Between two Windows XP machines it worked fine, it didn't, as I expected, get an IP address via apipa, and I had to set static addresses. Pretty fast, though not as fast as normal 1394, I suppose there's some overhead in creating IP packets, and tunneling them through 1394. This was between a laptop and a desktop, with all other network connections disabled. Re-enabling the normal ethernet connection on the desktop, and creating a network bridge between the two ports allowed the laptop to obtain an IP address from the DHCP server, and to talk through the desktop to the rest of the network, and beyond. I have not yet been able to test between a pc and a Mac; the Imac in the office does not have the necessary version of the software on it. The Apple site says that IP over 1394 is built in to the 'Panther' version of the software, but not 'Jaguar'. I'm not sure which version numbers of the system these are, but I know that 'Panther' is the newest one, and we don't have it yet. The download from the Apple site for use on older versions of the system seems to only be available to registered developers, which I am not. If it works as well with Apple as it does with XP, then I can't see any problem with it. I will see if our Apple person has a copy of the update for the older system.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 10-27-2003 12:32 PM                     Anybody can be a registered developer. It doesn't cost anything. If you want support from Apple plus all the developers tools, news and updates then you have to pay. But anybody who wants to keep abreast on new developments can register.  |  IP: Logged Nate Lehrke Master Film Handler Posts: 396 From: Denver, CO Registered: Oct 2002 posted 10-27-2003 03:26 PM                     Well, this all came up because I wanted to transfer files from a windows laptop to my Mac but since I didn't have much luck, I ended just purchasing an 80 dollar external burner for the laptop. I think that I had previously screwed with that laptop too much and caused it to not be recognized by the Mac. Thanks for all the help and suggestions though! At least I learned how to do it for the future now.  |  IP: Logged

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