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Topic: Anybody know how to make a psychedelic light show?

Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-06-2004 09:10 PM

I've got a band coming to the Performing Arts Center that I'd like to put on a psychedelic 60's light show. I'm thinking of doing the old "Oil Projector" on the cyclorama.

This is a school so I can get the overhead projector from the A/V department. I can get the pyrex petri dishes from the Chemistry department.

What do I use for the liquid(s) in the petri dish? Mineral oil and water? What do I use for coloring? Food coloring? Oil paint?

I know of a "kitchen chemistry" trick where you put food coloring in milk and drop in liquid dish detergent. It makes the color swirl. Do you think that will work?

Has anybody here actually done an oil drop light show?

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Wayne Keyser
Master Film Handler

Posts: 272
From: Arlington, Virginia, USA
Registered: May 2004

posted 12-06-2004 09:39 PM

Overhead projector, flat glass tray of clear water, little pools of salad oil colored with food coloring, and a fairly large semi-spherical clear glass (chemistry labs call it a "watch glass") to muddle the liquids about. Be prepared to change out the liquids now and then.

Also, a slide projector (did you know Kodak has stopped making them?) with slides of the bands' names in hi-contrast white (clear film) on black, and wiggle that around and mess with putting the watch glass in front of the beam.

Trust me ... I spent an evening watching in the light show booth one night in the 60's at the Electric Circus. Of course, I don't remember anything except what I wrote above, but that was the 60's.

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000

posted 12-06-2004 09:50 PM

Wow, memories of junior high school ('67-'70) dance band lighting come flowing back... [Big Grin]

Yes, oil and food coloring will work quite well. I used layers of no-color plastic to separate the various dyes and thus create additive color mixes. You can also mix dyes on the same layers to get subtractive mixes, but every now and then you'll have to wipe those layers clean and start over--the subtractives turn to the color of mud after a while.

Don't use oil paint unless you want to piss off the AV guys. [evil]

I never tried the "kitchen chemistry" thing you speak of but it sounds like it should work just fine.

I also used to make oscilloscope-like patterns on the cyc by taping a mirror to a monitor speaker and bouncing an ellipsoidal off of it onto the cyc. Experiment with different positions and locations on the cone for the mirror to get various "busy" patterns.

Sounds like a fun project for you. [thumbsup]

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-06-2004 10:52 PM

Quoted from woodrow.org
or any other site you can Google. Use: "cat's meow" and "milk".

quote:

Experiment "Cat's Meow"
Purpose

To observe the unusual behavior of milk as it is acted upon by a common household detergent.

Materials for the Class

* four - six sets of various food colorings
* One quart of milk
* One small container of household detergent -dishwashing liquid or shampoo-
* Materials for the Group
* One toothpick
* One pie pan or petri dish

Procedure

Students should pour the milk into a small aluminum pie pan or a petri dish to a depth of about one cm. The milk should have time to "sit" for a minute so that there aren't any currents from the pouring process. A couple of drops of the four different water soluble food colorings should then be added to the milk near the edge of the container at 0, 90, 180, and 270 degrees.

Observations may begin when a toothpick dipped in detergent is touched to the surface of the milk in the center of the pie pan. Students should be encouraged to "play" with the system as they wish in order to enhance their observations.

Students may be asked to suggest hypotheses which might explain the phenomena they observe. How is it possible that the fairly quiet pan of milk is now exhibiting such activity? As the hypotheses are forwarded, they can be recorded on the blackboard or overhead. This process usually results in an interesting variety of possible explanations for the unusual activity.

One of my side interests is to teach Mr. Wizard style kitchen chemistry to grade school kids. (My wife runs the local historical museum. They put on a Day Camp every summer. I volunteer to be a councilor/potions master.)
"Cat's Meow" is one of the tricks I teach. Kids love it. If I did it in a clear Pyrex pie plate on top of an overhead I bet the pot heads would like it too! [Wink]

I was thinking about making the oscilloscope thingy too. What do you do with that one? Just use silicone glue and affix a couple of mirrors to the centers of the speaker cones? That's the way I've seen it done before.

I planned to tear apart an old boom box and cannibalize the speakers then plug the line-input of the boom box into the "Aux-Out" port(s) of my board. I have a couple of unused mic lines I can put "turn-arounds" on and use as "sends".

I also have a video projector permanently mounted in the auditorium. If I re-aim it I can make it show on the cyc. I've done a few of the things like you said by putting the band's logo graphic into a PowerPoint presentation.

Another thing I want to find:

Is there a program that makes psychedelic designs like the "visualizers" in a lot of the media/music players like iTunes? I want something that I can make the designs pulse to the beat of the music received through the line-in port on the computer.
The iTunes visualizer is great but it only works with music played through the program, not from live music.

If I can do those three things I think I can put on a right-fine light show! [Smile]

The only thing I need now is a couple of Vari-Lites. Anybody got a few spares lying around that they don't need?

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Thomas King
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 119
From: Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 12-07-2004 04:56 AM

Solar 250 effects projectors. With enough of them, you don't need any other sort of light.

Winamp has more visulisations than you can shake a stick at, as well as a semi-decent plugin structure. I'm not sure if it comes with the input plugin you need to turn signals from the line-in into funky effects, but it's certainly easily downloadable. I've done it a few times. Doing AV for gigs is a cushy job [Smile]

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Ken Russell
Film Handler

Posts: 23
From: Smyrna, GA USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 12-07-2004 08:45 AM

My favorite from many, many years ago was to get a low power helium neon laser from the physics lab and a magnetic stirrer and a beaker from the chem lab. Fill beaker about 2/3 full of water, place on stirrer with the magnet in it, direct laser into side of beaker with the stirrer on. Instant room on fire.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 12-07-2004 01:08 PM

quote: Ken Russell
My favorite from many, many years ago was to get a low power helium neon laser from the physics lab and a magnetic stirrer and a beaker from the chem lab.

Lots of regulations come into play when you are using lasers, especially when you can get specular reflections of the direct beam:

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=DIRECTIVES&p_id=1705

quote:
STD 01-05-001 - PUB 8-1.7 - Guidelines for Laser Safety and Hazard Assessment

http://www.uaf.edu/safety/lab_safety_module.htm#seven

quote:
Almost all lasers that produce visible light beams are so bright that they can produce eye injuries. Therefore, to reduce risk of health hazards to the eye, many are designed in a way, such as enclosing the laser beam in a box, which prevents direct eye exposure to the beam.

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Thomas King
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 119
From: Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 12-07-2004 02:10 PM

"Laser" beams.

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-07-2004 03:28 PM

Let's see if I remember my laser classes:

Class I: Laser pointers and small, low power diode lasers. Not dangerous to the eye unless you look directly into the beam.

Class IIa: Medium power lasers up to a few milliwatts. The human blink reflex will protect against the accidental "hit" in the eye.

Class IIb: Medium power lasers with a spread beam. Power levels the same as Class IIa. Spread beam lessens the possibility of eye damage because less energy hits the retina per measure of area.

Class III: Medium to High power lasers that will produce eye/tissue damage if the beam lands on a person. All due precautions must be taken.

Thus, a ClassIIb would be the type used in most laser shows. And, yes, I know about the laws regarding the use of lasers in public shows. I wouldn't pretend to know enough to be able to put on a laser show for the public. I've done cool tricks with lasers for friends and things like that but I wouldn't do it in public without a lot more study.

IF I did a laser effect at all it would be limited to aiming a laser pattern at a dark scrim... Put a light-colored cyc at the extreme upstage. Put your cyc lights on the next pipe(s) down from that. A few lines down, hang your scrim. Project your gobos and laser effects onto the scrim. It will look like the image is floating in mid air above the stage! [Cool]

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Bob Healey
Film Handler

Posts: 93
From: Milford, CT
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 12-07-2004 08:29 PM

At school when I'm doing lighting for a band, 95% of the instruments i get are 1K par cans. 4-6 strong colors and a light board thant can sync to the music plus a few creative chases produces some pretty good shows.

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Ken Russell
Film Handler

Posts: 23
From: Smyrna, GA USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 12-08-2004 05:59 AM

I seem to have caused a little stir. At best what I had to play with 30 years ago was near the power of a laser pointer of today. I do understand the safety issue. But... using red green and blue laser pointers and placing a mirror, facing the beaker, between the audience and the pointers could make a spectacular, low power, safe effect. Gotta love tinkering.

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-08-2004 09:48 AM

I've got a full complement of stage lighting and a good lighting console at my disposal:

About 150 ETC Source Fours (750W lamps) ranging from 5º to 36º.
30 Source Four PARs (750 w).
8 Strand 3-Cell Cyc lights
8 Altman 3-Cell Ground Row lights
12 Altman "Scoops" (500if lamps)
Assortment of old-style PARS and Fresnels (From the "old" theater on campus.)

We have 192 dimmers & circuits (dimmer per circuit) permanently installed in the house:

4 On-stage Electrics @ 30 circuits ea.
2 sets of box boom (torms) @ total of 60 circuits.
1 Front of House catwalk @ 30 circuits

If I run out of cicruits I can get 48 more by bringing in some CD-80 portable dimmer paks from the other venues on campus.

My lighting console is a Strand 520i.

It has audio beat input. It will flash the lights, etc. to the beat of what it "hears" on the line-in port. I have a pair of AKG condenser mics permanently mounted above the stage. I can patch those through to the light board. If the sound guy from the band will "throw me a line" I can key the audio beat right off the drummer or the bass player.

The console speaks MIDI. I don't have a computer/MIDI controler to plug into it, though. [Frown]

It also knows how to control about 100 different brands of moving lights. We don't stock moving lights in our inventory but we can rent them if we need them. My boss won't rent them for this gig, however. [Frown]

If anybody's got some spare moving lights lying around that they aren't using, I'd be glad to take them of your hands. [Wink]

As far as lighting goes, I think we've got that covered. I want to add in a few extra special effects on top of what we do already. I've done just about everything I can with the standard stuff. It's fun but I want to do something new. The band that I'm thinking about has a few numbers with a psychedelic tinge to them. I'd love to have an oil projection effect on the cyc for this show. The mirror-bounce oscilloscope effect would be cool. too.

One last thing I was thinking about.
I am considering whether I should put some pie pans filled with water on the floor, just downstage from the cyc. Then you put a mirror in the bottom of the pan and shine a spotlight down into the pan. A fan blowing on the surface of the water keeps the surface rippled. When the light reflects off the mirror, through the rippling water and shines on the cyc, it looks all "wavy-like".

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Thomas King
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 119
From: Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 12-08-2004 11:16 AM

Please, no liquids on stage. No matter how good it looks, *someone* will stand on the edge of the pan, covering a distro box (if you're lucky) or the lighting desk (if you're not).

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