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Author Topic: Industry Standards in radio? Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-01-2006 08:47 AM                     I have to send some audio files to a guy at a radio station. He is going to make them into a radio commercial. I made them into .aiff files, sampled at 44 kHz. then posted them on my webspace for him do download. I get a call, this morning stating that the guy can't open the files. He tells me he wants me to re-encode them as MP3s. I explained that I made them into .aiff files because they have the highest quality out of all the formats I have available. His answer to me was, "Yes, but MP3 is the industry standard..." I call, "BULLSHIT!"... Comments, please...  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 03-01-2006 08:52 AM                        The guy is right. In fact, the broadcast industry probably has NO standards now. Some cling to the past(tape, reels, carts, DA-88,etc) , some mail media, some email MP3. This is why the "digital AM & FM will fail," Bad programming, no creativity and also no audio quality. I had better sound in 1977 on regular FM that I can receiver right now. Too bad. (XM rules)(Sure makes you appreciate that 35mm film standard.) Louis  |  IP: Logged Steve Scott Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1300 From: Minneapolis, MN Registered: Sep 2000 posted 03-01-2006 10:58 AM                     The AM news station I interned at while at the money pit that is Brown Institute used mostly mp3's as well. They were only picky on the modulation of the file & how fast you burned it to a CD, if applicable. They also loved to use minimal bitrates, 96 kbps was the average file. Brown taught using Adobe Audition & Scott Studio media server systems. We only used carts during our first semesters. Beyond collegiate social problems, I was constantly frustrated by the school's teaching style. The school recruited so many people that had no technical know-how & the studio classes felt catered to them, anyone with any brains about a soundboard & entertaining content had to wait for the others to learn basic typing & math. Needless to say, most of those types interned at Clear Channel owned top-40 stations. I was really engaged working in a news format, but I'm turing more towards broadcast engineering nowadays. Too broke to make the move to a job like that, tho.  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 03-01-2006 12:58 PM                       Probably a good move, Steve. That job doesn't pay much these days. I'm shocked to hear stations settling for mp3's, although I probably shouldn't be surprised. I made a trailer for Clear Channel stations a couple of years ago, and I told them I needed their v/o audio recorded as a 48KHz .wav or .aiff file... they didn't know what to do! They also kept sending me 44KHz files, so I finally gave up and just up-converted it (yuck!).  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 03-01-2006 02:46 PM                     You can hear the compression on many stations as it is right now. What's really driving me away from radio these days is the horrible processing they are putting their content through, all in the name of "we're louder".  |  IP: Logged William T. Parr Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 823 From: Cedar Park, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 03-01-2006 02:51 PM                     quote: Brad Miller all in the name of "we're louder". Which translates into were more distorted  |  IP: Logged Chris Greenwell Film Handler Posts: 28 From: West Valley, Ut Registered: Mar 2003 posted 03-01-2006 03:23 PM                     Yeah that is how 95% of our spots come in is via email (mp3), I havent seen a reel in at least two - three years. But yes the sound quality does suck on some of them, and some of the stations here in salt lake do compress the hell out of there audio, if you watch them on the modulation meters its stuck at one spot. but the station engineer where I work is for sound quality more than being loud, but were still loud and got some dynamics.  |  IP: Logged Steve Scott Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1300 From: Minneapolis, MN Registered: Sep 2000 posted 03-01-2006 03:53 PM                     It seems like the internet is more of a threat to the radio industry than the net is to theatres, yet both face similar trouble with standards & obligations. I'm an XM subscriber & the friend I live with has Sirius, both are great services. XM had some compression issues after its startup. From what I read on the XM forums, it was due to all the new channels they added at once, but it's recovered and still beats the hell out of FM. A former assistant manager I worked with at Lakeville was part of XM's Minneapolis traffic report launch. She would email reports during drive time on some timed basis. If I had started school a semester earlier, I would have had the opportunity to work for 89.3 FM, Minnesota NPR's newer music station. They are member-supported music from all genres, uncut with many rare recordings, NPR music programs & commentary from jocks that are more inviting & sponsor-friendly than any of the other shit on air in town. Naturally, they were warmly received in a place like Minneapolis & have seen great promotional success. Aside from that station, the others either play off the fact that they're not Clear Channel to drive ratings, or they're a CC station & they use all those billboards around town to show it. Quote Hunter S. Thompson: "The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side."  |  IP: Logged Robert Burtcher Expert Film Handler Posts: 194 From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma Registered: Jun 2005 posted 03-04-2006 04:23 AM                     Clear Channel seems to also enjoy using Windows Media for their spots. I can hear the differences between MP3, Real Media, and Windows Media at low bitrates, and it makes me cringe when I hear a snipe on the radio that, I swear to God, must have been recorded with WMA7 at 16kbps & 16kHz (in laymans terms, artifacts/noise like you wouldn't believe). Then immediately afterward, they jump to regular programming, making the horrible quality of the snipe stand out.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 03-04-2006 09:28 AM                        Remember when "Broadcast Quality" was a compliment? Louis  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-04-2006 01:12 PM                     quote: Louis Bornwasser Remember when "Broadcast Quality" was a compliment? Louis It is really sad to see all this happen in a day and age when the transmitters are actually alot better than they ever have been. Good solid state transmitters are one reason you are hearing all the compression artifacts better than ever. The downturn of radio is a role model for the demise of film. Mark  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-04-2006 09:20 PM                     So, bascally, his answer, "Yes, but MP3 is the industry standard...", translates to, "I don't know and I'm too stupid to know the difference." ?? ...Depressing... And, is all of this why I can hear distortion in the background of certain radio programs that sounds sort of like a computer modem? They are compressing the hell out of the audio to send it from place to place and the CODEC they use is producing the distortion as an artifact?  |  IP: Logged David Stambaugh Film God Posts: 4021 From: Eugene, Oregon Registered: Jan 2002 posted 03-04-2006 09:45 PM                        Eugene's dinosaur-rock station KZEL (owned by Cumulus Media) plays some commercials that sound absolutely awful. The worst is one for a jewelry store that's horribly distorted. Apparently the station has no technical standards whatsoever for what they'll accept from an advertiser (or advertising agency). Another ad has a very low-frequency rumble in it that drives my home theater subwoofer crazy. What's really annoying is sometimes their computer-stored version of a song that's in heavy rotation is chopped off before it's actually over. Steve Miller's "Fly Like an Eagle" is an example. The last 30 seconds or so is cut off and they keep playing it that way. Their explanaion is "It's the computer". Duh, it's not the computer, it's the person who made the MP3 file or whatever the hell it is they play.  |  IP: Logged Steven J Hart Master Film Handler Posts: 282 From: WALES, ND, USA Registered: Mar 2004 posted 03-04-2006 10:08 PM                        The local radio station where I record my ads for the theater uses Adobe Audition formatted to WAV files. The spots produced locally sound very good, but many of the agency spots that are sent to the station are low bitrate MP3's and you can really tell the difference on the air. quote: Steve Scott I'm an XM subscriber & the friend I live with has Sirius, both are great services. XM had some compression issues after its startup. I'm a Sirius subscriber and have been very disapointed with the sound quality. The only reason I've got Sirius is because relatives gave it to me for christmas. All the music programing sounds like really low bitrate MP3's, and the voice only programing sounds even worse. Do any of you have the same feelings about Sirius? I wonder if I've got a bad receiver (Sporster), or if the sound of this service is really this bad. I find myself turning Sirius off and listening to FM because I can't handle the smeary highs and total lack of bass. Steve  |  IP: Logged Steve Scott Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1300 From: Minneapolis, MN Registered: Sep 2000 posted 03-04-2006 10:11 PM                     David, the automated music storage systems have configurable cues for crossfading or cold-cutting. Somebody at that station was probably never trained, isn't authorized or is too busy selling commercial spots to change it. Like a projectionist lazily applying cues.  |  IP: Logged

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