Need to play a DVD thru NEC900 running IMS1000

[Bill Seipel]

Somehow we were allowed to book a film that isn't available on bluray.

For our throwback films, we usually play the blurays and all seems fiine. The manager has swears that DVD's will NOT work. I don't know if this is just what she's been told or doesn't quite have the tech experiecne to "make it happen" or what.

From reading the manual of our NEC900 as well as the software (Dolby IMS1000) it seems as though we can simply utilize the HDMI input and proceed.

However, from researching this it seems that others either have 'color' problems or 'sound' issues.

I am headed to the theater today with DVD player and HDMI cables in tow...


We have an NEC NP-NC900C-A

I can confirm the Dolby automation software version shortly.

[Steve Guttag]

It should work. Potential issues are the output of your player and who/what is doing the scaling. DVDs are standard definition and top out at 480p so something needs to scale that up to 1080p. Note, this is all based around the 4:3 image ratio (setting aside that it isn't encoded with square pixels like a Blu-ray). So, if you have a letterboxed DVD for a 1.85, 2.35 or even a 16x9 material...you will have letterbox bars within the 4:3 square(ish) picture (an image hovering in the middle of your screen). You may have enough zoom in your lens to blow that out but remember, you are merely magnifying that low resolution so it will look rough...and if you zoom the lens, you light will go down with it.

It IS possible to use the projector's ICP module to scale an SD image to fill the imager but you should be familiar with how it works before attempting. It is done by changing the input parameters to define the incoming area of interest and the final Aspect Ratio. But...you need to constantly be thinking in terms of the original resolution. Again, you'd be zooming in (this time via a scaler so there isn't a light penalty like a lens zoom) on a low resolution image so it won't look great but neither is the source image...when blown up to theatre sized screens. The Input settings are called the "Source" settings and are within the PCF (Projector Configuration File) in the Title creation of the NEC You also need to ensure that the scaler is on (within the Advanced settings of the Title creation. And remember, if you mess with it and save, you will have overwritten your normal Title used for your presets if you don't, first, create a new Title to work with and any saves to any parameter used by another title need to be saved in a different name. Having fun yet?

Ideally, as with all disc shows, try to do all of this in DCP O Matic and create a DCP of the content. DOM will let you do the scaling there.

Also note, DVDs are native 60i with the 3:2 pull down conversion in them (when from 24fps material, like movies)...so you might get motion artifacts that are more apparent on the big screen.

Presuming you have a Blu-ray player running your DVDs...it is likely scaling the output to 1080p/60...but it likely is not addressing letterbox bars...if that is the case, the same rules apply as above but all of your source/input numbers are referenced to 1080. So, think of the full 4:3 frame as 1440x1080. Thus, if you want say a 1.85 letterbox scaled to fit your "Flat" screen size. The Source numbers are 1440x778. That should cause the ICP to scale the 1080p image from a Blu-ray to electronically zoom into the letterbox within the 4:3 DVD image.

[Bill Seipel]

It should work. Potential issues are the output of your player and who/what is doing the scaling. DVDs are standard definition and top out at 480p so something needs to scale that up to 1080p. Note, this is all based around the 4:3 image ratio (setting aside that it isn't encoded with square pixels like a Blu-ray). So, if you have a letterboxed DVD for a 1.85, 2.35 or even a 16x9 material...you will have letterbox bars within the 4:3 square(ish) picture (an image hovering in the middle of your screen). You may have enough zoom in your lens to blow that out but remember, you are merely magnifying that low resolution so it will look rough...and if you zoom the lens, you light will go down with it.

It IS possible to use the projector's ICP module to scale an SD image to fill the imager but you should be familiar with how it works before attempting. It is done by changing the input parameters to define the incoming area of interest and the final Aspect Ratio. But...you need to constantly be thinking in terms of the original resolution. Again, you'd be zooming in (this time via a scaler so there isn't a light penalty like a lens zoom) on a low resolution image so it won't look great but neither is the source image...when blown up to theatre sized screens. The Input settings are called the "Source" settings and are within the PCF (Projector Configuration File) in the Title creation of the NEC You also need to ensure that the scaler is on (within the Advanced settings of the Title creation. And remember, if you mess with it and save, you will have overwritten your normal Title used for your presets if you don't, first, create a new Title to work with and any saves to any parameter used by another title need to be saved in a different name. Having fun yet?

Ideally, as with all disc shows, try to do all of this in DCP O Matic and create a DCP of the content. DOM will let you do the scaling there.

Also note, DVDs are native 60i with the 3:2 pull down conversion in them (when from 24fps material, like movies)...so you might get motion artifacts that are more apparent on the big screen.

Presuming you have a Blu-ray player running your DVDs...it is likely scaling the output to 1080p/60...but it likely is not addressing letterbox bars...if that is the case, the same rules apply as above but all of your source/input numbers are referenced to 1080. So, think of the full 4:3 frame as 1440x1080. Thus, if you want say a 1.85 letterbox scaled to fit your "Flat" screen size. The Source numbers are 1440x778. That should cause the ICP to scale the 1080p image from a Blu-ray to electronically zoom into the letterbox within the 4:3 DVD image.

The good news is the video works, but NO AUDIO.

We previously tested a standard playlist and the audio works fine with ingested DCP playlists.

But trying to figure out why no audio!

Running Dolby IMS3000. My mistake.

[Bill Seipel]

UPDATE:

Learned some things today.

I really really don't care for the way Dolby IMS3000 user interface is setup. Not real intuitive. And there's NOTHING in the manual about ejecting playlists.

1. EJECT a playlist (one that's ended)
2. Load a playlist
3. PLAY the loaded playlist

And make sure the Device Controller INPUT is set to 'HDMI'

And that should do it.

Everything works as expected. No surround sound but thats okay.

[Dave Macaulay]

Check the Player settings for audio format. It's normal with BluRay to default to DTS which Dolby doesn't accept, but I've not seen that with a DVD. If you set it to stereo PCM output you should get sound. Or Dolby Digital. Are you using the IMS as your sound processor? That changes a few things and may affect HDMI but it should be able to have sound.

[Bill Seipel]

Check the Player settings for audio format. It's normal with BluRay to default to DTS which Dolby doesn't accept, but I've not seen that with a DVD. If you set it to stereo PCM output you should get sound. Or Dolby Digital. Are you using the IMS as your sound processor? That changes a few things and may affect HDMI but it should be able to have sound.

Sound IS working now. Did not have to alter any audio settings.

However....

The manager came up to double check and I had forgotten to turn the bulb OFF.

She said it smelled HOT in the booth. Woops....

Crisis averted.

So the projector had almost nothing to do with why DVDs wouldnt work. They had been trying to play them in a bluray only player.....

[Carsten Kurz]

There are bluray-only players? Because, usually, you wouldn't even notice the difference between DVD and Bluray on any standard player. Insert disk, press play.

[Bill Seipel]

There are bluray-only players? Because, usually, you wouldn't even notice the difference between DVD and Bluray on any standard player. Insert disk, press play.

Apparently. Either that or someone was doing something wrong.

I just bought an HDMI splitter and a monitor for queuing up the DVD/Blurays. Nothing takes you out of the movie magic like seeing a MENU...on screen.

[Carsten Kurz]

We actually use a simple HDMI switch - that makes sure, if you see something on the preview monitor, it can never be on screen at the same time.

[Ed Gordon]

We actually use a simple HDMI switch - that makes sure, if you see something on the preview monitor, it can never be on screen at the same time.

I can confirm that a simple HDMI switch works fine. I have 2x1 switch at home that connects a UHD player and a computer to the switch which then connects a single HDMI line to an amplifier which is connected to a 4k projector. It can be sensitive to what is powered on first, but after that I have not had any HDCP problems and do get Dolby or DTS Master audio. If I only get stereo, I have to power cycle the amp to get 7.1 audio back.

[Marco Giustini]

I am not aware of a Blu-Ray only player. If your DVD didn't play I feel it was a different issue.
Sound-wise, DVDs have Dolby Digital on them by standard. The IMS should accept it but you might need to play with your player's settings a bit. Failing that, you can patch the player via TOSLINK to your sound processor.

Beware of splitters and switches. HDMI was never designed to be shared between displays. When you plug an HDMI player to a display, it does the "handshake", that is, it queries the display to find out what it is capable of.
Splitting and switching simply cannot work with that. Of course it MIGHT/WILL work but it won't be reliable.

Good switchers/matrixes will provide their own handshake on both ends so the player won't see the signal is being switched or re-routed.

Again: a switch/splitter can work but you might/will end up with a black screen every now and then.

[Ioannis Syrogiannis]

Are there bluray-only players? [...]

I am not aware of a Blu-Ray only player. [...]

I remember -once upon a time- Sony wanting to take out the CD functionality out of their PlayStation consoles. Is there a chance that someone would try to cut expenses in such a way?