Epson EB-L770U Compatibility

[Calin Diaconu]

Hello everyone,

I am doing volunteer work for a small film festival, and I ended up having some technical responsibilities since I am one of the most technically-inclined members of the team (I have a computer science degree, although I have no practical experience with projection equipment, much like everyone else in the team).

After many years of renting the projection equipment, we acquired a projector earlier this year, namely an Epson EB-L770U. Some films that we would like to show at our events only get sent in a DCP encrypted format, and so I tried looking into compatibilities for our projector. After doing some online research and exploring a bit the menus and manuals of the projector, I can tell that it is a rather office-oriented model, and it's probably a long shot to ask this, but is there any chance that, with a proper playback server, we would be able to show this kind of media (encrypted DCPs)?

I am also open to more general advice about the projection equipment, given our situation. After spending some hours reading about this topic, I can understand that the best we could do if we would like to show this type of content would be to either rent a team that has D-cinema equipment (the company that we were contracting would also not be able to show encrypted DCPs), or get in touch with a consultancy company to guide us on what equipment to choose, but both options exceed our budget at the moment. Previously, we would only show films that the distributors would provide in consumer-friendly formats, and so far it worked fine, but we would like to have more flexibility when it comes to the selection, in order to be able to include newer productions as well.

Also, I guess that our best bet would be to get in touch with a proper cinema, either for hosting or for advice, but the last one in our small city has been closed for more than 20 years, and the closest one is a commercial multiplex (part of a national chain), more than one hour away. This lack in our community is one of our motivations for pushing forward with the festival, but also puts us in a rather difficult position for interacting with other cinema specialists.

Thanks,
Calin

[Randy Stankey]

What is the "Mission Statement" of your film festival? Is this an occasional event, put on as a fund raiser? Is it a regular event for paying customers?

What size venue are you in? A classroom sized space? An auditorium? How big? How many people? What is the distance between the projector and screen? What size is the screen? What kind of sound system do you currently use? What equipment, beside projector, do you use to source your movies?

The answers to these questions will help you decide what to do and what equipment you should buy, if any. If you are hosting an occasional event, you might be better off keeping things as they are. If you are hoping to go into business as a regular cinema, you'll certainly want to upgrade to more professional level equipment.

It sounds, to me, like you are a modern reincarnation of the movie "Cinema Paradiso" which is set in a small village in Italy, post-WWII, has no television or other entertainment except for the local movie house, "Cinema Paradiso," which becomes the social center of the town.

If you haven't seen it, I recommend it!

If your situation is similar, it might be best to work up to the goal of building a full-sized cinema. Keep what equipment you are using, now. Raise money to buy what you need to reach your goals. Possibly even take donations from the public.

I know. I sound simplistic and reductionist. My reason is to keep a good perspective on goals. It is a common habit to start at the goal and work backward instead of starting at the beginning and working toward the goal. It's a simple change in perspective that can make a big difference. I am, often, guilty of it.

[Mark Gulbrandsen]

If you HAVE to run DCP's you will either have to either buy or rent the gear. If you buy, stay away from Series 1 equipment as it is very old,and availability of parts are questionable. Even Series 2 gear is getting really old, but there is more of it around so you can get more projectors still in usable shape or use the parts to keep the stuff you purchase running. Obviously Series three or four would be the best, but most expensive bet.

I would start by getting a hold of Prevost at the info below. They may sell or rent directly, or they may want to go through another tech or Equipment Company. Either way, they built film projectors for about a hundred years, and now supposedly distribute DLP gear. I hope this helps.

update: Ihave not found a contact yet that works for them. But I will continue to research it.

[Ryan Gallagher]

Agree it all is about the intent ultimately, and budget.

Most festivals have the luxury of specifying what format the submissions need to be in. If Encrypted DCPs don't work for you technically then that should be part of the submission guidelines, people who want you to show their film will make the necessary arrangements.

If you are hoping to mix in major studio releases that is where you'll run into the DCI requirement snags.

I think you're thinking correctly in terms of cost escalating sequence:
- Partner with an existing theatre (although sounds like none are in town).
- Rent a DCI compliant projector and associated server/IMS (and probably the techs to set it up)
- Rent that plus a screen & audio, the whole package (definitely want techs to do the setup).
- Buy the equivalent, but only if you have a permanent theatre and use for it. Don't go into the temporary projector business accidentally.

A baby step towards DCP submissions with existing consumer projectors is to try using software based DCP playout solutions that can output to non-DCI projectors.

I've heard NeoDCP ( https://www.neodcp.com/ ) is a popular approach for small festivals. It's not free but it's pretty cheap relatively speaking. It will technically also play encrypted DCPs, but most major studios won't issue keys for NeoDCP knowing that the whole chain is not DCI compliant etc.

[Carsten Kurz]

There are software players that support playing encrypted and unencrypted DCPs - these are used a lot by festivals around the globe.

https://www.neodcp.com

It depends on wether the rights holder will issue KDMs (decryption keys) towards this player solution. If e.g. you would aim to play mainstream hollywood content, all mainstream studios would decline issuing KDMs for a software player solution.

Often, these restrictions do not apply for smaller festivals with their typical title admission process. The festival will usually publish their player certificate for DCP based festival admission entries, and if the submitting party has a problem creating KDMs towards your software player, then their submission could simply be denied by the festival organisers.

Of course, it would be best if sooner or later you could enable funds towards a fully DCI compliant system (vs. a software-only player that is only 'DCI compatible').


- Carsten

[Calin Diaconu]

Hello everyone, thank you for the answers, they are all useful. In the meantime, I have also read some more documents that answered many of my questions, especially from FIAF.

The answers to these questions will help you decide what to do and what equipment you should buy, if any. If you are hosting an occasional event, you might be better off keeping things as they are. If you are hoping to go into business as a regular cinema, you'll certainly want to upgrade to more professional level equipment.

If your situation is similar, it might be best to work up to the goal of building a full-sized cinema. Keep what equipment you are using, now. Raise money to buy what you need to reach your goals. Possibly even take donations from the public.

Indeed, I personally feel that we lack a stable direction, a "mission statement" as you called it, which is the effect of some changes in management over time, so I can't give you a precise answer. All of us are involved in the festival pretty much on a voluntary basis because we want to keep alive these opportunities (usually a 5-day festival once a year with other occasional events) to show, in a social context, to the local community, a selection of films that the people might not choose to watch on the TV, or on streaming services.

There is a long and politically-infused story about a potential cinema as well: the building of one of the old ones still exists, it was publicly owned, then privatized, and the space was used for other purposes (pizzeria, club, casino, and some others I think). After a long trial, the township won the space back a few years ago, and the target is to transform it back into a cinema, but they don't have the budget for this yet.

So far, we would try to hold many screenings outdoors, in different neighborhoods of the city, for us to come closer to the public. We would still like to do so, but this year we got access for the first time to this old cinema, and we used the same equipment (projector, sound, and chairs) that we would use for the other screenings (outdoors and indoors, since we would also go to some small auditoriums that were available), which makes me hope that some time in the future we will end up having a more professional setup, stationary to that location, even before the cinema will end up being renovated. However, I'm not sure how ready our organization would be to go into a more regular business with this.

It sounds, to me, like you are a modern reincarnation of the movie "Cinema Paradiso" which is set in a small village in Italy, post-WWII, has no television or other entertainment except for the local movie house, "Cinema Paradiso," which becomes the social center of the town.

If you haven't seen it, I recommend it!

It's a humbling comparison, knowing how passionate were the team and the citizens in the story, so thank you I was lucky enough to attend a screening where the director was also present, about a year ago, I absolutely second your recommendation.

I know. I sound simplistic and reductionist. My reason is to keep a good perspective on goals. It is a common habit to start at the goal and work backward instead of starting at the beginning and working toward the goal. It's a simple change in perspective that can make a big difference. I am, often, guilty of it.

Not at all, I also feel similarly about this issue, maybe it is also a "defect" I got from my day-to-day work background, but I would seek a better defined organization and purpose.

If you HAVE to run DCP's you will either have to either buy or rent the gear. If you buy, stay away from Series 1 equipment as it is very old,and availability of parts are questionable. Even Series 2 gear is getting really old, but there is more of it around so you can get more projectors still in usable shape or use the parts to keep the stuff you purchase running. Obviously Series three or four would be the best, but most expensive bet.

Yeah, it's not mandatory to show DCPs, it would just give us more flexibility in the selection process, since even this year we had a number of recent films that we wanted to show that would only come as encrypted DCPs.

It's not yet very clear to me, how could I differentiate Series 1/2/etc equipment? Does this numbering refer to their generation (1st/2nd gen)? And where is it mentioned on product pages? I also think that if we decide to acquire D-cinema equipment, we will probably end up contacting a national distributor that will explain this better.

Most festivals have the luxury of specifying what format the submissions need to be in. If Encrypted DCPs don't work for you technically then that should be part of the submission guidelines, people who want you to show their film will make the necessary arrangements.

Yes, in our case, the public submission part of the festival is student-oriented and we receive the films in consumer-friendly formats. It's some recent feature films that are still in the festival run that we would like to bring and show, that are not yet accessible to us.

A baby step towards DCP submissions with existing consumer projectors is to try using software based DCP playout solutions that can output to non-DCI projectors.

I've heard NeoDCP ( https://www.neodcp.com/ ) is a popular approach for small festivals. It's not free but it's pretty cheap relatively speaking. It will technically also play encrypted DCPs, but most major studios won't issue keys for NeoDCP knowing that the whole chain is not DCI compliant etc.

There are software players that support playing encrypted and unencrypted DCPs - these are used a lot by festivals around the globe.

https://www.neodcp.com

It depends on wether the rights holder will issue KDMs (decryption keys) towards this player solution. If e.g. you would aim to play mainstream hollywood content, all mainstream studios would decline issuing KDMs for a software player solution.

Thank you both for this lead, at the moment, given our budgets, I think that this will be our first choice. I have already let the team know about this solution and we will see what our plans will be around this. We don't necessarily target Hollywood productions, so my hopes are that national distributors of smaller, art festival-oriented content, will be more understanding with this.

[Ioannis Syrogiannis]

[...]
It's not yet very clear to me, how could I differentiate Series 1/2/etc equipment? Does this numbering refer to their generation (1st/2nd gen)? And where is it mentioned on product pages? I also think that if we decide to acquire D-cinema equipment, we will probably end up contacting a national distributor that will explain this better.
[...]

Yes, that is the spirit between the series classification.
You might read of it or not on product pages, but I am not sure you may find anything still in production/for sale of series 2.
There is second hand equipment that is offered in much lower prices than buying new equipment. The downsize of that is that you may get in trouble trying to find spare parts, as more and more of them get difficult to be found.
I have seen on LinkedIn that some companies that provide service and sales of new equipment also support aftermarket support. And, if you put the spare parts concern aside, I trust that they themselves are trustworthy.

I can't tell what the situation of that is in Italy (or is it Romania), but if the team wants to consider, maybe Elia Orselli, a member of this forum from Bologna could point you to the right direction. (?)

[Calin Diaconu]

I can't tell what the situation of that is in Italy (or is it Romania), but if the team wants to consider, maybe Elia Orselli, a member of this forum from Bologna could point you to the right direction. (?)

Thanks for the lead, but the festival is actually happening in Romania.

[Stefan Scholz]

The use of a properly configured computer and NeoDCP seems to be a way that could work for you. Still, not every distributer supports it. But many do for such type of event.
DCP projection is now 10+ years the only choice European theatres have to screen film content. (I know about the few 70 mm or 35 mm releases, which do not count as a general)
Many projectors are swapped for newer models these days. Looking around, and you actually find something that eventually still works, without any major problem. Often all it needs is pickup, to assist the former operators from carrying it themself towards a recycling plant. More problematic and costly is the choice of lenses, the old one might not come with whatever you need. You might need a tele lens, and many theatres often used a moderate wide angle zoom. They can still be bought, as many modern projectors still use identical lens mounts and motorized controls.
But be aware, simply storing these away after the shows is not a clever thing to do. There are small backup batteries holding certificates in media player/ server units, which are eventually at the end of their lifespan, when obtaining your unit. Keep these serviced, run the gear once in a few weeks for an extended time (without lamp) in power on condition to recharge accumulators and get a feedback about battery status. There's normally a timely warning.
I have never taken back old equipment from sites we installed new laser in. I sometimes assisted in finding someone, willing to carry the old units away, for reuse privately, or for something like your festival.

I can only encourage you, to go that way, also in your local surroundings. Even asking your national exhibitors central office, they might have something to donate, which then should not be used in a commercially operating theatre, as this is feeding your competitor, but certainly in this type of non profit festival.